Orcullo vs Ronnie Allen

tucson9ball

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These types of questions come up all the time. How would the younger players hold up against the older players if?

I think in all sports, the players keep getting better and better. The equipment gets better and the overall level of play gets better.

JMHO, but I think the younger guys would be able to handle the older guys in their prime.
 

piggybank04

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orcullo against some of the older guys? probably--against ronnie in his prime? i dont think so......
 

jrhendy

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Could he of faded it when Ronnie was at the top of his game?

They call him Roboman or something like that, but I have seen him lose his cool. Ronny would have had him tearing his hair out in a couple hours. Plus, his moving is weak for a top player, but he more than makes up for it with shotmaking and cueball control. That is the style of modern day one pocket.

In the day, I don't think he could hang with Ronny.

He has to get credit for winning the US Open One Pocket, but I think Biado will pass him up shortly as the best Filipino one pocket player.
 

NH Steve

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They call him Roboman or something like that, but I have seen him lose his cool. Ronny would have had him tearing his hair out in a couple hours. Plus, his moving is weak for a top player, but he more than makes up for it with shotmaking and cueball control. That is the style of modern day one pocket.

In the day, I don't think he could hang with Ronny.

He has to get credit for winning the US Open One Pocket, but I think Biado will pass him up shortly as the best Filipino one pocket player.
I agree with this. Biado clearly brings some billiards experience to his One Pocket.
 

bstroud

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One pocket is a much different game today that it was 30 years ago.

It would be hard to compare Dennis and Ronnie.

In his day Ronnie was the best. I know first hand. He is the only one pocket player I never played for money. Played everyone else even. Ronnie offered me 8/7 9/8. I didn't take it.

If Ronnie was the same age as Dennis today I think he would be the better one pocket player by far. Dennis plays all day every day to maintain his shooting ability. Ronnie never practiced. He just played. He had more imagination at the game than anyone I ever saw play and I have seen them all starting with Lingo.

Bill S.
 

tylerdurden

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That is some strong praise for Ronnie.

It is interesting to me how the general sentiment MAY be that guys shoot better today, yet perhaps thought and moved better in years past.

The other thing about the Filipinos is they don't seem to be willing to go down too much at all. I have seen a lot of one and two barrel firings and done. Then there was the story Hacker posted on here; the guy loses one set and cries like an 8 year old girl.
 

androd

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That is some strong praise for Ronnie.

It is interesting to me how the general sentiment MAY be that guys shoot better today, yet perhaps thought and moved better in years past.

The other thing about the Filipinos is they don't seem to be willing to go down too much at all. I have seen a lot of one and two barrel firings and done. Then there was the story Hacker posted on here; the guy loses one set and cries like an 8 year old girl.

Gamemanship !
Trust me, nobody cares.
Rod.
 

Fast Lenny

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One pocket is a much different game today that it was 30 years ago.

It would be hard to compare Dennis and Ronnie.

In his day Ronnie was the best. I know first hand. He is the only one pocket player I never played for money. Played everyone else even. Ronnie offered me 8/7 9/8. I didn't take it.

If Ronnie was the same age as Dennis today I think he would be the better one pocket player by far. Dennis plays all day every day to maintain his shooting ability. Ronnie never practiced. He just played. He had more imagination at the game than anyone I ever saw play and I have seen them all starting with Lingo.

Bill S.
I am sure you wish you would have played just for the experience. I saw Ronnie here and there and would have a little small talk near the bar but never got to play him, wish I would have though even though he was at the end of his road.
 

tylerdurden

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Gamemanship !
Trust me, nobody cares.
Rod.

I do, but perhaps you are right of course.

I saw players pull very unscrupulous stuff in pool halls over the years, and they would be the ones in action the next night.

Either A) pool players have very short memories, or B) they simply do not care as you say. I think it is a little of both.
 

onepockethacker

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Forget about Orcullo.. The best one pocket player ever is EFREN REYES.. HANDS DOWN.. PERIOD.. For all those older gentlemen on here that think Ronnie was better... WAKE UP!!!!.
Every sport the players get better as time goes by. Especially in one pocket since all the live streams, accustats, books, etc. All that knowledge that gave the movers 30 an 40 years ago the advantage over shooters is out in the open. EVERYONE knows the moves now days.
There are more better players and straighter shooters playing today. Europe, Philippines, China, Taiwan, etc. I.E. more competition.. Reyes won 5 Derby city one pocket events in a row that he competed in. Races to 3, 400 players, that is the greatest one pocket accomplishment ever.. PERIOD. Anybody who thinks that any other player that has ever played one pocket could accomplish that.. DREAM ON...
 

Tom Wirth

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Forget about Orcullo.. The best one pocket player ever is EFREN REYES.. HANDS DOWN.. PERIOD.. For all those older gentlemen on here that think Ronnie was better... WAKE UP!!!!.
Every sport the players get better as time goes by. Especially in one pocket since all the live streams, accustats, books, etc. All that knowledge that gave the movers 30 an 40 years ago the advantage over shooters is out in the open. EVERYONE knows the moves now days.
There are more better players and straighter shooters playing today. Europe, Philippines, China, Taiwan, etc. I.E. more competition.. Reyes won 5 Derby city one pocket events in a row that he competed in. Races to 3, 400 players, that is the greatest one pocket accomplishment ever.. PERIOD. Anybody who thinks that any other player that has ever played one pocket could accomplish that.. DREAM ON...

Agreed.^^^^
 

WhatWouldWojoDo

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Sports past and present

Sports past and present

Like said before, its different as the game improves. Better equipment, stronger players, and more information available. If you went back to the 30's you wouldn't be able to see the great players unless you went to the tournament and watched it yourself. Now you can sit at home and stream the matches or even go back and rewatch over and over if you wish.

With before the internet - the pool world must of seemed so large. But now, with the internet you can find out who's playing where and for how much. You can find out where the most action is and who's playing best.
 

FastEddieF.

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Forget about Orcullo.. The best one pocket player ever is EFREN REYES.. HANDS DOWN.. PERIOD.. For all those older gentlemen on here that think Ronnie was better... WAKE UP!!!!.
Every sport the players get better as time goes by. Especially in one pocket since all the live streams, accustats, books, etc. All that knowledge that gave the movers 30 an 40 years ago the advantage over shooters is out in the open. EVERYONE knows the moves now days.
There are more better players and straighter shooters playing today. Europe, Philippines, China, Taiwan, etc. I.E. more competition.. Reyes won 5 Derby city one pocket events in a row that he competed in. Races to 3, 400 players, that is the greatest one pocket accomplishment ever.. PERIOD. Anybody who thinks that any other player that has ever played one pocket could accomplish that.. DREAM ON...

onepockethacker is 100% right. Ronnie would have no chance against Reyes
 

mr3cushion

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Eddie Taylor, Ronnie Allen, Leonard "Bugs" Rucker and Chicago Artie were MUCH better gamblers/hustlers and knew more about what it took to beat their opponents than the players today.

Each one of these past GREAT players had their own style of intimidating their opponents. It's true, the game has evolved into something new, but, they were such, "well rounded" players they would be able to adapt to any players style of today. JMHO!

Bill Smith "Mr3Cushion"
 

piggybank04

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someone said todays players are better at op--while that may be true, you sure wouldnt know it from watching you tube videos--there is some truly awful one pocket from some of these modern players.......
 

wincardona

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If the truth was known Eddie Taylor was probably the best one pocket player back in the day, at least that's what people like "Corn Bread Red" and Danny Diliberto have to say. Plus there were many other top players that are in agreement with placing Taylor above Ronnie and all the other greats back then. I'm sure Rodney has heard the same, plus he himself could possibly have an opinion on who was the best, after all he seen both play probably many times and may have played them both as well.

I myself never played Taylor, nor have seen him play. However, I have played Ronnie a bunch of times getting 10 to 8 and it was close. I also played Reyes a bunch of times, probably more than any other player has, and I can say without hesitation that Reyes was the best player I have ever played.

What I think makes people think that players back in the day were better one pocket players, is that there was really no competition back then as compared to players of today. So consequently when a top player played back then, especially against a lower level player the experience factor was so tilted that it made the experienced player look better than he actually was. The few experienced players back then were way ahead of all the other players that they played and because of that it was easy for them to win a much higher percentage of the time, which imo created a false perception of the greatness of the players back then. (in terms of rating them) However, I do believe that Taylor, Bugs, Ronnie, Kelley, and a few more of the top players back then could of more than held their own against any of the players of today..with the exception of Reyes. He stands alone...:sorry that's my take.

Dr. Bill
 

tucson9ball

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I am sure you wish you would have played just for the experience. I saw Ronnie here and there and would have a little small talk near the bar but never got to play him, wish I would have though even though he was at the end of his road.


Hey Lenny,

I had a chance to warm up with Ronnie a couple years back. It was at Kolby's state championship when Henderson/ Grady was happening.
I saw Ronnie hitting balls and nobody was with him. I "jumped" over there and asked if he wanted to play some? Anyhoo, we shot the bull while we played and he tried to lay down so I would gamble later...LOL
His shot-making was no longer there, compared to years ago, but you could tell he moved and trapped people pretty good. I wish I could have seen him play when he was younger.
One thing for sure, Ronnie still liked to trash talk during that tourney. I remember him getting in Nick's face about how Nick broke the balls (early Corey Dueul style). Ronnie told em to play for 1K a game...lol....Nick didn't know how to respond.
It was fun to hit balls with a living legend. I will remember those few games forever :)
 

Tom Wirth

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Dr. Bill and the others who believe Efren to be the greatest player ever to have played the game. I include myself in this camp. I can't help but wonder how much better players like Taylor, Allen, Kelley, Bugs, and maybe a few others would have been had they had more high level players who could push them throughout their pool careers. This is why I don't think these kinds of comparisons are all that fair.

Still with all that aside, Efren was consistently the best we have seen but he too will be surpassed should the game survive as we know it. That is the nature of all things.

Tom
 
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bstroud

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As most of you know I spent some time on the road with Taylor.

Ronnie would never play Taylor even one pocket.

The one time they played it was even one handed.

Taylor robbed him. I was in with him.

Taylor had the knack of raising his game to the level necessary to win.

It would be interesting to see Efferin and Taylor play if they were the same age. I think Taylor would just bank his way out of any trap he was in. I would be betting on Taylor. He was just too hard to beat. No one wanted to play him anything even.

Bill S.
 
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