Matching-up choice

[mr3cushion]

...small...small...small....I just didn't want your fans to be led down a rabbit hole........due to your not understanding.....could cost them some money.....ya know?......

Pro sweater and 'Knocker!" Proud of yourself! This is exactly why everyone, if you do decide to play, I'm sure pulls against you!

 

[beatle]

bill, darrel, both let it go. not worth getting worked up over a post.

 

[jtompilot]

Jim, according to your logic, a player you play even, can have all the breaks and give you 9/8?

I’ll give you two explanations.

You’ll never beat anyone it you can’t turn around a break. Last year Scott Frost beat Danny Smith 10-0. What was Danny’s winning percentage on his break? A big fat ZERO.

I’ll flip the scenario. I’m playing a better player and he’s giving me the choice of getting 10/8, 9/8 or the breaks. I’ll take the balls and turn around a few breaks and beat the pants off him

 

[mr3cushion]

bill, darrel, both let it go. not worth getting worked up over a post.

You're right, He's not worth it!

 

[mr3cushion]

I’ll give you two explanations.

You’ll never beat anyone it you can’t turn around a break. Last year Scott Frost beat Danny Smith 10-0. What was Danny’s winning percentage on his break? A big fat ZERO.

I’ll flip the scenario. I’m playing a better player and he’s giving me the choice of getting 10/8, 9/8 or the breaks. I’ll take the balls and turn around a few breaks and beat the pants off him

Jim; I'm not a, 'stats' 1P guy. But, I would bet the breaker wins more games in the first 3 innings than his opponent.

 

[lfigueroa]

Hello! I'm talking straight pool to sorackem.

Yes, I saw that.

But you were addressing, "...straight pool runs from the break..." A 14.1 break leaves the CB up table which means, unless you're mad at your money, that only the two down table pockets matter.

Lou Figueroa

 

[lfigueroa]

Lou,

It's not only the possibility of manipulating the rack to either favor or disfavor getting balls in a better position near your whole, but also manipulating the rack to maybe lessen or increase the possibility of scratching depending on who's racking.. While it's true that each player has the perfect right to inspect the rack, most players today would prefer to solve the concern of a poor rack by racking their own. I believe the rerack rule came directly from this rack your own thing to counter any potential funny business, which most think is appropriate. If players didn't think there was the possibility for funny business they wouldn't have come up with the rerack rule.

I think the rack your own was to eliminate two things, OK, three:

1. Loose racks
2. Tilted racks, and
3. Dirty looks and evil thoughts after scratching on the break because of 1 & 2.

Lou Figueroa

 

[lfigueroa]

Just one more comment for now.

I think it is foolish to superimpose what happens between two pro-level players, statistically or otherwise, onto a game between amateurs. I think the stats go out the window the further down the food chain you go.

Lou Figueroa

 

[darmoose]

bill, darrel, both let it go. not worth getting worked up over a post.

Of course your right......I chose to follow your advice last night, but, it looks like your gonna have to gag 3c to get him to do likewise.

 

[darmoose]

Just one more comment for now.

I think is foolish to superimpose what happens between two pro-level players, statistically or otherwise, onto a game between amateurs. I think the stats go out the window the further down the food chain you go.

Lou Figueroa

I think this is correct.

 

[darmoose]

I think the rack your own was to eliminate two things, OK, three:

1. Loose racks
2. Tilted racks, and
3. Dirty looks and evil thoughts after scratching on the break because of 1 & 2.

Lou Figueroa

I think you are correct, as I said earlier. But being as what is good for the goose is also good for the gander, when the breaker now makes a ball on the break, the dirty looks again fly, thus the rerack rule.....

 

[gulfportdoc]

I play a match with the same opponent a couple times a month and we generally play 10 - 15 hours and we usually make it on the break 4-6 times between us both. One night a couple months back I made one on the break 11 times and once four times in a row and he never made it. My back was tired from all the extra racking. LOL

I think it is a skill to get it close and maybe a little luck to make it, kind of like putts over 25 feet.

-don

That's a pretty good analogy, Don. A guy could practice the break shot all day, but his odds of making a ball on the break are still very small. OTOH a guy could practice, say, a long straight back bank for the same amount of time, and his odds of making the shot after that would be very high.

Add to that different tables, different cloths, clean/dirty pool balls, different moisture content-- making a ball on the break is pure luck, and should not be rewarded. The object of the break shot is to hit that 1-2 ball pocket perfectly, and to leave the CB in a tough position for the opponent.

 

[gulfportdoc]

Doc,

Did you ever hear of reracking after a ball was made on the break when they weren't playing rack your own? I never heard of rerack until this rack your own thing came about. Where I play, the only time anyone brings up the rerack rule is if the other guy suggests rack your own. When we play opponent racks ofr the shooter, rerack never comes up.

No, I never did. Re-rack after pocketing a ball on the break is a very recent rule. But, as above, I don't believe the rule was instituted as an antidote to rack manipulation.

 

[beatle]

the more a person tries to make one on the break, the more he sacrifices in hitting a good break that sends balls his way and at the same time leaves nothing for his opponent.
i endorse letting the player keep his ball. and i think opponent should always rack and the player can always challenge the rack and have it adjusted.

 

[OldSchool]

A guy could practice the break shot all day, but his odds of making a ball on the break are still very small.

Add to that different tables, different cloths, clean/dirty pool balls, different moisture content-- making a ball on the break is pure luck, and should not be rewarded. The object of the break shot is to hit that 1-2 ball pocket perfectly, and to leave the CB in a tough position for the opponent.

^ All of that is correct.

 

[OldSchool]

No, I never did. Re-rack after pocketing a ball on the break is a very recent rule. I don't believe the rule was instituted as an antidote to rack manipulation.

Correct again Doc. All of this talk about rack manipulation being the reason for the re-rack is off the mark - just like most all conspiracy theories. The real reason for the re-rack is that top players/pros, who are competing for $5,000 - $50,000 paydays, do not want to lose their chance of winning said monies/never even get to get out of their chairs to compete in a particular game, because of the happenstance of their opponent making a ball on the break and running out, or just about running out. And I don't blame them one bit for feeling that way.

Old School

 

[Billy Jackets]

This matching up discussion came up today between two guys, so let me get some opinions from you guys > Which do you think is a bigger spot, and which would you rather give up to a player who plays approx. 1-1/2 balls under you - 10-8/9-8 or all the breaks?

Old School

Giving up all the breaks, for me is a no brainer. I am a mover first ,so most of the time , if I can spot you the break, I didn't give you anything, except a bit more time to play each game , I am going to grind you out and we are playing even, every game . You should win very few games, if any.
Likewise, If I give you balls and you break good , if the game is fair , there will be games I am never in , or have to make a circus shot or 2, to have a chance because you got too far ahead, and I have to play too defensively.

 

[lfigueroa]

My recollection is that both rack your own and the re-rack rule were popularized by their use at the DCC.

The rack your own was to avoid rack manipulation issues. The reason for the re-rack was to even things out for the short races to three. Then, as players went back to their home rooms all over the country, they began to use those rules when matching up, finding they liked them.

Lou Figueroa

 

[mr3cushion]

the more a person tries to make one on the break, the more he sacrifices in hitting a good break that sends balls his way and at the same time leaves nothing for his opponent.
i endorse letting the player keep his ball. and i think opponent should always rack and the player can always challenge the rack and have it adjusted.

Period!

 

[darmoose]

the more a person tries to make one on the break, the more he sacrifices in hitting a good break that sends balls his way and at the same time leaves nothing for his opponent.
i endorse letting the player keep his ball. and i think opponent should always rack and the player can always challenge the rack and have it adjusted.

good thoughts........used to be exactly this way til the break was basturdized with rack your own........