Svb/shuff 2012 dcc #2

Island Drive

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Spin whitey with half tip of 9 o'clock slightly jacked up and kick at the 3 to the ten, you could easily make a ball and the safe off the bottom rail to the ten....whitey goes behind the stack comin' off the bottom rail.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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I believe I'd shoot this shot. Have to use a little draw from there to get the right angle but it pays off if it goes.

cbd.jpg
 

bstroud

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Straight into the 6 and force the cue ball to the side rail at first diamond.

The 6 should bank and move balls to your pocket.

Bill S.
 

NH Steve

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Spin whitey with half tip of 9 o'clock slightly jacked up and kick at the 3 to the ten, you could easily make a ball and the safe off the bottom rail to the ten....whitey goes behind the stack comin' off the bottom rail.
I don't like to kick hard in this situation because the cue ball tends to get away.

I think kicking softer, to kick into the lower half of the 3-ball, which should drop the cue ball to the rail behind the 10-ball. A simple controllable shot.
 

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vapros

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CD, that's a nifty maneuver, and anybody who can play four-rail shape deserves a beignet, so I am sending you one.
 

Island Drive

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I don't like to kick hard in this situation because the cue ball tends to get away.

I think kicking softer, to kick into the lower half of the 3-ball, which should drop the cue ball to the rail behind the 10-ball. A simple controllable shot.
....ThuMbs uP....was simplier.
 

wincardona

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All the options chosen that entail either kicking softly into the 3 ball, or floating off the 6 ball toward the 10 ball are imo not worth shooting in this situation. You're not really getting anything done that a simple return safety wouldn't remedy, sorta like dancing with your sister.:sorry There are two shots that I like and not sure which one is best, post#4 Cowboys bank gets a lot done, he positions a ball on his side and positions the cue ball where he puts his opponent in trouble. If he happens to make the bank he's fixen to do some damage.
Plus you take the 15 ball away from your opponent's side of the table, a ball that he could do serious damage with.
The risk factor with the shot is fairly low, but if you hit the bank poorly there is a possibility of a kiss. (not likely) All in all a very strong shot.
*
Post#5 Stroud's shot is also a good shot that will create positive action for the shooter. Depending on how the 6 ball is positioned with the 13 ball will be a major concern, if I feel that the carom will send the 6 ball toward the meat of the 3 ball I would strongly consider this shot understanding that going into the 3 ball will give me my best action plus the hit is an easy one. The negative with this shot as opposed to Cowboys shot is that you don't have the ability to lock down the cue ball as often or as well as with Cowboy's shot.

I like Cowboy's shot a little better because I can execute his shot with consistency, Strouds shot is also a very good shot but does have a few leaks to it, imo.

Dr. Bill
 
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One Pocket Ghost

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All the options chosen that entail either kicking softly into the 3 ball, or floating off the 6 ball toward the 10 ball are imo not worth shooting in this situation. You're not really getting anything done that a simple return safety wouldn't remedy, sorta like dancing with your sister.:sorry There are two shots that I like and not sure which one is best, post#4 Cowboys bank gets a lot done, he positions a ball on his side and positions the cue ball where he puts his opponent in trouble. If he happens to make the bank he's fixen to do some damage.
Plus you take the 15 ball away from your opponent's side of the table, a ball that he could do serious damage with.
The risk factor with the shot is fairly low, but if you hit the bank poorly there is a possibility of a kiss. (not likely) All in all a very strong shot.
*
Post#5 Stroud's shot is also a good shot that will create positive action for the shooter. Depending on how the 6 ball is positioned with the 13 ball will be a major concern, if I feel that the carom will send the 6 ball toward the meat of the 3 ball I would strongly consider this shot understanding that going into the 3 ball will give me my best action plus the hit is an easy one. The negative with this shot as opposed to Cowboys shot is that you don't have the ability to lock down the cue ball as often or as well as with Cowboy's shot.

I like Cowboy's shot a little better because I can execute his shot with consistency, Strouds shot is also a very good shot but does have a few leaks to it, imo.

Dr. Bill

I agree with all of the above...:).......Bill S.'s (a power shot) and Dennis's (a finesse billiard-shot) are the two best shots here - excellent choices, and I would have a tough time deciding between them...

Although I lean towards Bill's shot, because just like Ronnie A. always did, I love power shots...and as Billy I. said, it's a can't miss hit and you're going to get a lot of offense/positive ball movement out of it - enough so, that I'd be willing to risk the downside of possibly leaving a return shot.

- Ghost

PS, And hey Dennis...trust me (with my 45 yrs. of playing 3cushion) on this...you don't have to use low/draw english with your billiard shot angle...you just need slightly higher inside running english - that flattens/shortens the angle just like draw, but is easier to apply and control.

PPS, You probably already know what I've just said anyway - but others can benefit from the info.
 
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vapros

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Ghosteroonie, I'm always ready to learn something, but on this shot don't you mean inside running english? A typo, maybe? :eek:
 

One Pocket Ghost

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Ghosteroonie, I'm always ready to learn something, but on this shot don't you mean inside running english? A typo, maybe? :eek:

My dear Mr. V....I have no idea whatsoever what you speak of...if you go back and look, you'll clearly see that I said inside english...:)

- Fantasma

PS, But, on the bottom of the page of my post, please don't notice the documented time of a very recent edit...;)
 

lll

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i am missing something here:confused:
please explain
mr. strouds shot or the "power shot" as the ghost called it
by going into the 6 and caroming off the 13 doesnt that cause the 13/5/2/11?
to open up for shuff??
yes you will move ball(s) to your side but you will open up more balls that go for shuff???:confused:
i guess the reply will be you will move more balls for your favor and those balls that open up for shuff will be "blockers"for the now
and the balance of good and bad is in favor of good????
p.s. i like dennis shot the best so far
p. p.s. even tho i know the shot and the result my question is based on how i see the layout and my analysis of the shots mentioned so far
 

wincardona

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Ghosteroonie, I'm always ready to learn something, but on this shot don't you mean inside running english? A typo, maybe? :eek:
Mr. V. there is no inside running english with this shot, running english helps the object ball to run where as inside engish creates a slide or resistance with the shot. In this instance the slide will lengthen the angle because the angle departing the first rail will lengthen therefore sending the object ball long. The adjusted spin (inside) will guide the object ball to slide off the first rail which will create the angle to hit deeper going into rail#2 which in turn will create a shorter angle departing the 2nd. rail, which will lengthen the shot after it hits the 3rd. rail. I THINK Would that be correct Ghost?:)

I stand corrected, everything is predicated on the angle going into the first rail. With this particular shot the high inside ball seemed to shorten the shot because it was going into the first rail flat, as opposed to going into the first rail at a steeper angle, which imo would then shorten the shot.
Dr. Bill
 
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One Pocket Ghost

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i am missing something here:confused:
please explain
mr. strouds shot or the "power shot" as the ghost called it
by going into the 6 and caroming off the 13 doesnt that cause the 13/5/2/11?
to open up for shuff??


yes you will move ball(s) to your side but you will open up more balls that go for shuff???:confused:

i guess the reply will be you will move more balls for your favor and those balls that open up for
shuff
<------ Yes

will be "blockers"for the now
and the balance of good and bad is in
favor of good????
p.s. i like dennis shot the best so far
p. p.s. even tho i know the shot and the result my question is based on how i see the layout and my analysis of the shots mentioned so far

Larry, also, to explain your first question....you will not be opening the 5-2-11 for Shuff, because you will be hitting the shot firmly enough that those balls will be leaving the area :heh and may very well end up on your side of the table.

- Ghost
 

wincardona

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Larry, also, to explain your first question....you will not be opening the 5-2-11 for Shuff, because you will be hitting the shot firmly enough that those balls will be leaving the area :heh and may very well end up on your side of the table.

- Ghost
What you say is true to an extent, you will be opening up more balls for Shuff, but they will also be open for you as well. And yes some of the balls that are opened will go to your side of the table which is a plus but most importantly the reward for shooting shots like this power shot clearly out weighs the negatives that go along with some of these type of shots. Power shots are very strong shots when chosen at the right times, they change games and are very important shots to develop an understanding for. The main purpose for shooting power shots is that they put your opponent in a very threatening position where he will in most cases have to resort to a defensive posture. There is a little more risk with power shots that leave the cue ball at the foot end of the table, as opposed to dragging the cue ball to the head end of the table, but when they work well at the foot end of the table their more effective. This information is not directed at any one specific person I put it out for anyone who would be interested. But then again this is just my opinion.

Dr. Bill
 
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lll

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ghost and dr. bill thanks for the explanation.
it doesnt fall on deaf ears...:)
p.s. dr. bill i think you were referring to the CUE ball and not the OBJECT ball in your discussion of dennis shot to vapros since its the cue ball that goes 3 rails
icbw
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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I don't like a single thing about shooting the 6 from here, at least the way it looks to me on these pics. What are the good & bad things that can happen?

...............BAD THINGS...............

1. You put at least 8 balls in motion without knowing where they will end up.

2. If the 6 hits the balls on the endrail you put even more balls in motion without knowing where they are going.

3. You are shooting the 6 "through" part of the 13 and therefore must hit it harder to gain from it.

4. You "untie" balls that don't go for him right now and you do it for just a chance of making a ball.

5. You could easily sell out a cross-corner bank shooting the 6 like this.


...............GOOD THINGS...............

1. You might make a ball.

2. You might put some of the balls on your side. So what? They may also all be tied up. The 2, 5, 1 and 4 could easily all lay on your siderail.


Weigh the good against the bad gentlemen.

P.S. If you play the cueball to be nearer the footrail you have to shoot even harder to accomplish your objectives, you will be shooting the 6 "through" even more of the 13.

Dennis

Here's the general direction I think the balls are going if you shoot the 6 hard.


cbd.jpg
 

lll

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I don't like a single thing about shooting the 6 from here, at least the way it looks to me on these pics. What are the good & bad things that can happen?

...............BAD THINGS...............

1. You put at least 8 balls in motion without knowing where they will end up.

2. If the 6 hits the balls on the endrail you put even more balls in motion without knowing where they are going.

3. You are shooting the 6 "through" part of the 13 and therefore must hit it harder to gain from it.

4. You "untie" balls that don't go for him right now and you do it for just a chance of making a ball.

5. You could easily sell out a cross-corner bank shooting the 6 like this.


...............GOOD THINGS...............

1. You might make a ball.

2. You might put some of the balls on your side. So what? They may also all be tied up. The 2, 5, 1 and 4 could easily all lay on your siderail.


Weigh the good against the bad gentlemen.

P.S. If you play the cueball to be nearer the footrail you have to shoot even harder to accomplish your objectives, you will be shooting the 6 "through" even more of the 13.

Dennis

Here's the general direction I think the balls are going if you shoot the 6 hard.


View attachment 6479
does that mean you agree with me as to wonderfullness of this shot???:)
 

vapros

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Dr. Bill, in our discussion about Cowboy's shot, I think that the Ghost and I are on the same page. We are discussing the english necessary to take the cb around the table as shown, not running english on the object ball. Of course you are right, it will be holding english on the object ball and will surely hold it up, but I think getting the cb right is much more important than the bank shot in this instance. Making the bank would be lagniappe. Agree?
 
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