Gentile v Smith Shoot Out

[lfigueroa]

Exactly, Billy. I hear these guys say, "You gotta play traditional one pocket to beat Danny down." When a guy is shooting tough two rail banks on you and freezing you on the top rail for six hours, that's tough to fade, no matter who you are. He might leave you a tough shot, but your options are these: Duck, or shoot a blood tester that gets you one ball and might sell out the game. The traditional one pocket says, "Duck". Which he does, but then he leaves Danny a bank into the stack, which develops the table for Danny and your cue ball is again on the Hudson. Now when you duck, you are trying to keep him off four shots instead of one or two. Then he shoots a combo bank and buries his cue ball. Now he has six balls near his hole and you have a eight foot shot straight in and you are on the rail...again. Rinse and repeat for 10 hours.

The end result is relentless pressure and positive development of the table so that when you make a mistake, he just runs out. That kind of pressure will crack most.

I've played DS once and CG twice and to me the tougher of the two was CG. But I played a traditional game against both. I have to wonder if DS didn't figure out that if he played traditional, Chris would beat him to the shot, so he went more offensive.

Lou Figueroa

 

[gulfportdoc]

lol, I can commiserate with the part about out moving the other guy, beating them to the shot, and missing.

Lou Figueroa

Ditto here. It's very deflating to have managed the game well, and then finally get the opening a guy has been waiting for-- only to miss a relatively easy shot.

There's been a lot of ink used on this circumstance. But outside of the obvious reasons (nervousness, lack of confidence, old age, etc.), there are various other factors.

Amongst average players some guys are better movers than they are shooters. They're more comfortable plying the layout and putting the opponent into jeopardy. Other guys are shot makers, and are really comfortable shooting to make balls. So a shot-maker is going to tend to play weaker safeties, while the mover is going to miss shots that ought to be made.

I must be more of a mover. I rarely feel pressure when lining up for an important safety. There seems to me oftentimes more room for error in contrast to pocketing a ball. But on key shots where a miss could be equally as punishing, that's when the pressure can rear its ugly head, or second thoughts can creep in...

~Doc

 

[wincardona]

I don't believe this thread is about which style fits our game best, or what style of play we would feel more comfortable competing against. To me this thread is about Smith v Gentile, and how and why it came down like it did.

Danny Smith just didn't revise his play especially for Gentile, no, the play you saw against Gentile is the way Smith thinks and plays against all the top players that I have watched him play against. He's a very aggressive player that believes that moving balls and creating distance is an effective strategy that has proven to be very daunting for his opponent and beneficial for him. He has modeled his game to create pressure much like the great Ronnie Allen use to play. Lou mentioned in an earlier post that Smith is doing what any one can do, by sending the cue ball up table..not true. Smith has developed close to perfection with this type of shot and he has actually created a style of play based around this type of strategy, and executing it as good as I have seen any one execute it, including Ronnie. He has beaten every one he's played with this style, however, he's yet to play any of the true upper echelon players. I believe the next player he may play might be Justin Hall, Hall is regarded as a very strong one pocket player that has good financial backing, and I believe that's the next game Smith will be looking to play. Then possibly (if he wins) he may match up with one of the top five. Frost..Orcullio..VanBoening..Pagulayan..Reyes. IMO these five are the upper echelon of one pocket players. Smith has diligently worked his way up to this level, and i'm anxious to see who's next so I can watch him play.

Dr. Bill

 

[wincardona]

I don't believe this thread is about which style fits our game best, or what style of play we would feel more comfortable competing against. To me this thread is about Smith v Gentile, and how and why it came down like it did.

Danny Smith just didn't revise his play especially for Gentile, no, the play you saw against Gentile is the way Smith thinks and plays against all the top players that I have watched him play against. He's a very aggressive player that believes that moving balls and creating distance is an effective strategy that has proven to be very daunting for his opponent and beneficial for him. He has modeled his game to create pressure much like the great Ronnie Allen use to play. Lou mentioned in an earlier post that Smith is doing what any one can do, by sending the cue ball up table..not true. Smith has developed close to perfection with this type of shot and he has actually created a style of play based around this type of strategy, and executing it as good as I have seen any one execute it, including Ronnie. He has beaten every one he's played with this style, however, he's yet to play any of the true upper echelon players. I believe the next player he may play might be Justin Hall, Hall is regarded as a very strong one pocket player that has good financial backing, and I believe that's the next game Smith will be looking to play. Then possibly (if he wins) he may match up with one of the top five. Frost..Orcullio..VanBoening..Pagulayan..Reyes. IMO these five are the upper echelon of one pocket players. Smith has diligently worked his way up to this level, and i'm anxious to see who's next so I can watch him play.

Dr. Bill

This is the style of play that is stifling for his opponents.. if effective. I do understand that when you play a lock down game and suffocate your opponent that can be very stifling as well and has been proven to be for many more players, however, the type of game Smith throws at you is also stifling..just in another way. Smith stifles you with pressure, where Gentile stifles you with frustration. Gentile started to miss balls that he normally makes, plus he started to shoot shots that weren't in his game plan. I contend that "pressure" was the culprit and not that he was a tired player.

I believe if Danny Smith continues to play as solid as he played against Gentile he will be a threat to beat any one, and if you can't come off that top rail with some sort of consistency you're going to fall as well.

Dr. Bill

 

[lll]

question for dr. bill
you put efren on the list of top 5 candidates to play danny
do think efren can still shoot straight enough from the head rail to be a threat to danny?
meant with no disrespect to efren who i believe is the greatest 1p player ever.

 

[wincardona]

question for dr. bill
you put efren on the list of top 5 candidates to play danny
do think efren can still shoot straight enough from the head rail to be a threat to danny?
meant with no disrespect to efren who i believe is the greatest 1p player ever.

That's a great question Larry, I really don't know if he could beat Danny if he failed from the top rail I know it's hard to fathom but he may not be able to win. I probably would make Reyes the favorite, simply because he's Reyes and he's my hero, however, it really wouldn't surprise me if he lost. Reyes is still a great shot maker, just not in the upper echelon of ball strikers any more but still a better shot maker than Chris, Richeson, and J.J. It would be a very exciting and entertaining match to watch, and one that I would like to commentate.

Dr. Bill

 

[stevelomako]

Was in Chicago for this and other stuff.

One thing I saw from Chris and didn't really care for, was him eating a banana and a plate of tostadas while he was playing.

I mentioned it to Joey Gold and we talked about it a bit and both feel you need to eat before you play and stay "hungry" during your match. It's a little different when you take an hour break and might eat something light but to be eating stuff that sits like a rock in your belly while you're playing and shooting doesn't sit right and also takes away from your focus...which should first and foremost be the game you're in, not that you're hungry for food or you need to eat between shots.

I'll tell you later what Danny told me that you'll find interesting and shed some light on why he played and did what he did.

 

[Miller]

Was in Chicago for this and other stuff.

One thing I saw from Chris and didn't really care for, was him eating a banana and a plate of tostadas while he was playing.

I mentioned it to Joey Gold and we talked about it a bit and both feel you need to eat before you play and stay "hungry" during your match. It's a little different when you take an hour break and might eat something light but to be eating stuff that sits like a rock in your belly while you're playing and shooting doesn't sit right and also takes away from your focus...which should first and foremost be the game you're in, not that you're hungry for food or you need to eat between shots.

I'll tell you later what Danny told me that you'll find interesting and shed some light on why he played and did what he did.

you big tease.....

 

[stevelomako]

you big tease.....

They took a smoke break and Danny stops me and starts telling me he's getting bored and it's going too slow. I said what are ya gonna do? He says you'll see and after that he starts coming with the open break which deep down is playing somebody like they're a sucker because if they can't win those games how can they win at all?

It took a few breaks like that but he really got the wide open shoot out going after that.

 

[baby huey]

Billy, your analysis about this match is right on. What great players do though, is to stop your game in its tracks by countering it with something you can't handle. Artie alluded to it by saying if you are playing a great banker take his banks away, same for the eight and out specialist. But only top players have the ability to control the game that well. I agree that Danny's game will be better evaluated against Justin Hall who may not allow him to dictate like he did against Chris.

 

[u12armresl]

Great players, or even really good players, come with those shots when you think you've left nothing.

Billy, your analysis about this match is right on. What great players do though, is to stop your game in its tracks by countering it with something you can't handle. Artie alluded to it by saying if you are playing a great banker take his banks away, same for the eight and out specialist. But only top players have the ability to control the game that well. I agree that Danny's game will be better evaluated against Justin Hall who may not allow him to dictate like he did against Chris.

 

[Island Drive]

Was in Chicago for this and other stuff.

One thing I saw from Chris and didn't really care for, was him eating a banana and a plate of tostadas while he was playing.

I mentioned it to Joey Gold and we talked about it a bit and both feel you need to eat before you play and stay "hungry" during your match. It's a little different when you take an hour break and might eat something light but to be eating stuff that sits like a rock in your belly while you're playing and shooting doesn't sit right and also takes away from your focus...which should first and foremost be the game you're in, not that you're hungry for food or you need to eat between shots.

I'll tell you later what Danny told me that you'll find interesting and shed some light on why he played and did what he did.

One thing I've learned and incorporated into my game was being able to eat during play. I Always eat before I practice, because so often especially in a Tournament setting you can't depend on scheduled play times. Once I feel the blood sugar and concentration waning, I know I haven't eaten in 6 hours. Many times my game fell off, ate a burger/fries and quickly closed out the match. Couldn't imagine being waaaaaaaaaaaaay ahead and then give it all back because I didn't eat, makes no sense.

 

[straightback]

One thing I've learned and incorporated into my game was being able to eat during play. I Always eat before I practice, because so often especially in a Tournament setting you can't depend on scheduled play times. Once I feel the blood sugar and concentration waning, I know I haven't eaten in 6 hours. Many times my game fell off, ate a burger/fries and quickly closed out the match. Couldn't imagine being waaaaaaaaaaaaay ahead and then give it all back because I didn't eat, makes no sense.

Gambling sessions can get long. If you're hungry, you're hungry. I always try to get something I can eat with a fork - don't like grease on the cue.