Talking bout the breaks..............

[Billy Jackets]

Thanks Androd for the comment! Yes, I was young and self taught. The wrong long rail by my pocket to reach and stroke the ball towards my hole was the deciding factor for me. But, of course no one ever said I was breaking to the wrong pocket.
I wish more members would talk about Fats. He seemed that he was action, and could create it, and that always a good thing, even though not known to match up against say a Fitzgerald player. I just have to wonder if the Hustler Jackie Gleason was portrayed after Fats, it sure seems plausible.

But mr3c brought up the lag. In '61 @ Johnston City the winner of the lag in OP would maintain the choice of their scoring pocket even though they passed the break! In '62 @ JC they changed the lag to the way we modernly play the break. But, BCA in '67 when they adopted OP they then stayed with the original way the lag was played in '61 Johnston City, I do not know when they changed, nor why.
But I really like the original way '61 JC played it.
I agree with mr3c that OP should only lag for the break. The most highly skilled game should use skill to determine who breaks.

Being left handed and taking the right pocket meant I put my right handed opponent on his wrong side pocket also, and possibly the side he was not as use to. It also meant I was playing to the side I wanted anyway, and use to.
Whitey

This can open up a giant can of worms, but Tevis worked at a pool room, right in the heart of the hustlers trail . Fats made the circuit for years He would have had to be blind, deaf, and mentally deficient, to have missed Fats. He just didn't want to pay him anything imo.

 

[lll]

grady in one of his onepocket tapes
said the the shots you cant reach from one side vs the other even out so it didnt matter
i think i remember this correctly
shannon daulton as a lefty tends to break to the right pocket fwiw

 

[jtompilot]

grady in one of his onepocket tapes
said the the shots you cant reach from one side vs the other even out so it didnt matter
i think i remember this correctly
shannon daulton as a lefty tends to break to the right pocket fwiw

Shannon plays for the correct pocket

 

[lll]

Shannon plays for the correct pocket

isnt that the pocket recommended for righties??

 

[jtompilot]

isnt that the pocket recommended for righties??

My standard break is to the left pocket but do switch it up a bit. The first 10 to 15 years I broke to the the right pocket but have found much more success breaking to the left. I did win the MOT breaking to the left so it can’t be wrong

PS. You can have all the breaks if you want

 

[Dennis "Whitey" Young]

The lefty's know which pocket to break towards! breaking @ approx. 11: 50
Whitey

 

[12squared]

Whitey, with all things being equal as far as conditions as you s tated and if both players are either right or left handed, the biggest reason to break to the "wrong" pocket is...

... if the corner ball comes out after the break and leaves a thin cut for your opponent, it is way more awkward for them to cue that first shot. They would have to shoot that first shot opposite handed or behind the back or use the bridge or contort themselves in some way to make that 1st shot.

If a right handed player breaks to the right (right) pocket against another right handed player and sells out the corner ball, your opponent will have no problem cueing to make that first ball to the left (wrong) pocket where they can cue comfortably.

 

[darmoose]

All other thingy's being equal, It is surprising that experienced one pocket players will try to argue, using unique single or one time shot examples and circumstances that rarely come up, to attempt to rationalize breaking to the "wrong" pocket, which subjects the breaker to an entire game, which might last for a half hour to over an hour, with stunted access to the greatest number of shots to his hole, compared to what he would experience had he broke to the "correct" pocket in the first place.

Success and comfort comes with practice and experience. If one gets used to doing the wrong thingy, he naturally gets comfortable, just as he would by putting the same effort in doing the right thingy.....

Contrarianism is alive and well on OP.org....

 

[Dennis "Whitey" Young]

Whitey, with all things being equal as far as conditions as you s tated and if both players are either right or left handed, the biggest reason to break to the "wrong" pocket is...

... if the corner ball comes out after the break and leaves a thin cut for your opponent, it is way more awkward for them to cue that first shot. They would have to shoot that first shot opposite handed or behind the back or use the bridge or contort themselves in some way to make that 1st shot.

If a right handed player breaks to the right (right) pocket against another right handed player and sells out the corner ball, your opponent will have no problem cueing to make that first ball to the left (wrong) pocket where they can cue comfortably.

You make a valid point. That opening sell out corner ball is huge. Something more to thing about LOL! Thanks!
We just witnessed Luna playing to what is considered the wrong pocket for a lefty and he sold out the corner ball and left easy cueing for Corey.
This maybe is why Hawaiian Jimmy (RH) always broke to the wrong pocket against Mika (RH). Who knows! Or, maybe he likes easy cueing along his scoring pocket's long rail. That is why I did it, and I did not put anymore thought process into it either than that, young and inexperience.

I want to thank Darmoose for the thread, and to those that offered up some tidbits about Fats. Whitey

 

[cincy_kid]

For us taller players I am not sure how many if any shots we can't reach playing from the "wrong" side... that we can reach from the other...

 

[Dennis "Whitey" Young]

isnt that the pocket recommended for righties??

Larry, look at Shannon's next shot at 1:16, there is no way he cue's that shot if he had broke to the other pocket. RH players might not consciously realize a lefty is coming up to cut that shot!
And also by breaking to the wrong pocket he has put the shorter RH player playing to his wrong pocket making it doubling hard on Alex. Except if Shannon sells out the corner ball as 12 squared has offered up.

Sorry Darmoose, no offense intended, and yes we know it is to the wrong pocket. Lefty's should not be a factor in this discussion anyways.

Which corner did Jersey Red break towards?
When Jersey Red played Artie did he alternate corners on successive breaks?
Whitey

 

[mr3cushion]

Whitey, with all things being equal as far as conditions as you s tated and if both players are either right or left handed, the biggest reason to break to the "wrong" pocket is...

... if the corner ball comes out after the break and leaves a thin cut for your opponent, it is way more awkward for them to cue that first shot. They would have to shoot that first shot opposite handed or behind the back or use the bridge or contort themselves in some way to make that 1st shot.

If a right handed player breaks to the right (right) pocket against another right handed player and sells out the corner ball, your opponent will have no problem cueing to make that first ball to the left (wrong) pocket where they can cue comfortably.

Hi Dave, with all due respect, according to your logic, you're relying on your opponent to rack the balls bad for himself, hit the break poorly. Instead of having easier opportunity to run balls easier when you have that chance. As far as the ball popping out from either side, assuming the CB lands on or close to the long rail at, 2.5-3 diamonds, the only difference for, 'this' shot is, the RH player has their right arm/cue hanging over the table, where if the other side, the RH player has the cue over the outside of the rail! Only on this first shot after the break is it Not a problem! The closer the CB gets to the side pocket for the RH player on the right side, the more difficult it is to make balls that are closer to the bottom of the rack and short rail.

 

[gulfportdoc]

We were at the Cue Club in Las Vegas a while back. Ronnie told me that of the two feature tables, one always rolled differently and that you had to break from the other side. So knowledge of the tables is another reason you may wish to consider breaking from the other side.

Is that the room that Mary Kenniston and partner owned years back? Heard it was a good room then, but that it has since gone down hill. What was your impression?

 

[gulfportdoc]

... I wish more members would talk about Fats. He seemed that he was action, and could create it, and that always a good thing, even though not known to match up against say a Fitzgerald player. I just have to wonder if the Hustler Jackie Gleason was portrayed after Fats, it sure seems plausible. ...

Gleason's portrayal was almost the complete opposite of R. Wanderone. Sydney Carroll and Robert Rossen wrote the screenplay for The Hustler. Rossen also produced and directed the film. Rossen was a veteran of NYC pool rooms, and could have been aware of Wanderone. If he'd wanted the character to be like Wanderone he would have written it like that.

Some argue that the character in the book (not the movie) had some similarity to NY Fats (much was made reference of the character's tic), but Walter Tevis swore time and again that he had made up the Minnesota Fats character completely-- and I believe him. Fats of course lassoed the opportunity of a lifetime, when at the suggestion of Georgie Jansco, Fats set up a card table outside the local drive-in theater where The Hustler was playing, claiming to be Minnesota Fats. He parlayed the ruse into fame and fortune-- the premier hustle of his career.

 

[gulfportdoc]

grady in one of his onepocket tapes
said the the shots you cant reach from one side vs the other even out so it didnt matter
i think i remember this correctly
shannon daulton as a lefty tends to break to the right pocket fwiw

That's right, Larry. I was thinking of the same tape, and was going to get it out to recall exactly how he put it. But the gist of it was that the "handed" advantage of breaking to one side of the other evens out during play. So there is no "correct" side to break from.

 

[Kybanks]

If both pockets are equal, I break towards the left pocket. If one pocket is phony or gaffed then I break to the opposite pocket. If the table rolls off, I break to the pocket that rolls into the rail. Right or wrong pocket for me depends on how the table plays.

 

[NH Steve]

I also predominantly break to the "wrong pocket" lol. Being more of an occasional player than an everyday player, it's just easier to hit reasonably consistently from that one side.

Now all of you with the conventional wisdom about "you can reach more shots" when a righty has the left pocket -- that is true of course -- if you have made a ball and got position to run some more balls. BUT -- it completely overlooks the fact that we probably approach the table WAY MORE times every game facing the other side of the table -- and many cross corner bank opportunities too, of course -- and all of those safeties and banks are much easier for me to reach since I broke to the "wrong pocket". But hell yeah, if I was playing the One Pocket ghost, I would take the right hand pocket What say ye One Pocket wizards now?

 

[NH Steve]

Anytime my opponent breaks for the pocket I want, I break for the same pocket. I don't believe their is a rule you have to take the opposite side after his break. Makes it a little hard to keep up with who broke.

Right, there is no rule mandating pocket choice. In fact the rule is, the breaker chooses their pocket and every new game can keep or change their pocket choice. Only rule relates to when the break is spotted so the same player is always breaking. In that case, they are supposed to switch pockets each game. But given that "spotting the break" is usually when gambling -- and in gambling rules are only what the two players agree to. Or, they agree to turn to, in order to resolve a conflict.

 

[androd]

I also predominantly break to the "wrong pocket" lol. Being more of an occasional player than an everyday player, it's just easier to hit reasonably consistently from that one side.

Now all of you with the conventional wisdom about "you can reach more shots" when a righty has the left pocket -- that is true of course -- if you have made a ball and got position to run some more balls. BUT -- it completely overlooks the fact that we probably approach the table WAY MORE times every game facing the other side of the table -- and many cross corner bank opportunities too, of course -- and all of those safeties and banks are much easier for me to reach since I broke to the "wrong pocket". But hell yeah, if I was playing the One Pocket ghost, I would take the right hand pocket What say ye One Pocket wizards now?

If you were left handed you could reach those shots, very key shots playing one-pocket.
You can reach the shots along the long rail from your side, most can make those with a bridge.
You can't use a bridge shooting over the stack, it won't reach.

 

[beatle]

the best pocket for you is always the one that is more favorable to you than having your opponent have it.

for me the side of the table doesnt matter. but i want the hole that is easiest to pocket balls in, and the one that he wants and takes away his comfort level.