Is Fats a fit?

fred bentivegna

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One more little bang for the Fat Man. It is an excerpt from my new book, TEOPH. Dedicated to all those who didnt think he could play.



“Chicago Pony” and Fats

Fats pulled this hustle in Bensingers in the 40s. Chicago’s “Pony” Rosen was probably the best One-pocket player in Bensingers at that time. He usually played very cheap himself, but everybody loved to bet on him and his games, because he had a reputation for never doing business. Fats was spotting Pony 8 to 7 for $10 a game. Unlike what some people think, Fats had a very big reputation back then, and everybody wanted to bet on Fats. So Fats had cohorts stationed in the poolroom, and they were all betting on Pony. Fats sluffed off all the $10 games to an unwitting Pony, but his partners were collecting $200-$300 a game on the side. Nobody woke up, and Fats made a nice score.
Pony was tickled as he made $80 or $100 at the $10 level. Pony woke up to the scam later. He even loved to tell the story. "He kept leaving me banks." Pony said. "I couldn’t understand it. In those days if I got a shot I was gone."


Beard
 

Island Drive

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Dinnner 1941

Dinnner 1941

Fats on sidewalk.....greek and ev got out of car, Fats said to ev, wanna get something to eat? and I said yeah, so we went to one of the restaurants that was real close. So both of em said, would ya like to have a steak? I said yes....and the way it went, neither of em got a meal, just me. When they sat in the booth,. They were on one side of the booth, and here I was sitting alone on the other side of the booth. So, they fired questions at me just as fast as I could answer. And this steak was 1/4 '' thick and covered one of those Real BIG dinner platters, covered the plate like a heap. Then fats said, honey can I cut your steak for ya, so I said yes. And he cut it into little bites. As I took each bite, both of em would watch as each piece was transferred from my plate to my mouth, there eyes went down then up like dogs.
 

NH Steve

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Fats on sidewalk.....greek and ev got out of car, Fats said to ev, wanna get something to eat? and I said yeah, so we went to one of the restaurants that was real close. So both of em said, would ya like to have a steak? I said yes....and the way it went, neither of em got a meal, just me. When they sat in the booth,. They were on one side of the booth, and here I was sitting alone on the other side of the booth. So, they fired questions at me just as fast as I could answer. And this steak was 1/4 '' thick and covered one of those Real BIG dinner platters, covered the plate like a heap. Then fats said, honey can I cut your steak for ya, so I said yes. And he cut it into little bites. As I took each bite, both of em would watch as each piece was transferred from my plate to my mouth, there eyes went down then up like dogs.
These are great, Island Drive! Thank you for having gone to the effort to do this interview back when you could, and thank you for sharing it with us now!!!
 

Toncam

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That's great. I have two (2) DVDs, you know?

Beard

Yeah, im going to pick up the other one, banks that dont go but do.
I saw some of the promos for it on youtube and some of the stuff looks great, what i like to know is how some of these guys figured some of this stuff out, lol.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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A Little Woofing

A Little Woofing

This from "The Bank Shot And Other Great Robberies";

Fats is stuck $2000 to Danny Jones and Danny starts woofing him.

Danny Jones: You know who I am, Fat Man? I'm Fast Eddie and I've come all the way from California to get you.

Fats: Is that so? Well, tell me, Mr. Fast Eddie, did you happen to bring along a beautiful doll like Mr. Paul Newman did in the flick?

Danny said that was exactly right, only he had brought his doll from Atlanta, Georgia.

Fats: Well, somebody should warn that doll to be real careful of you, Handsome Danny. I understand you took a blood test when you went in the army and the doctors found out your blood was made up of 90% lipstick and 10% Coca-Cola.

Daddy Warbucks, who was staking Danny, called him over to the side and told him " I'm backing you with my cash because I think you have a chance to beat the Fat Man. But listen, son, don't make the mistake of trying to outtalk him-nobody outtalks the Fat Man. Nobody."

Warbucks told Danny exactly the way it was, only Danny didn't heed the warning and he kept giving me the needle.

"I really think you're all washed up." Danny said.

"I think so, too," Mr Tuscaloosa Squirrelly chimed in.

"And so do I," said Mr. Cornbread Red. "I think Danny and the Squirrel are right, Fatty. You're finished."

"Is that so?" I said to Mr. Cornbread Red. "Well, I'll tell you what I'll do. When I get through with Mr. Handsome Danny, which will be very shortly, it will be your turn to come to the table with the cash, Mr. Cornbread Red. And when I get through busting you down to your last dime and paying your bus fare back to Detroit, you'll be known as No Bread Red."

That was enough to silence the Bread Man, but it wasn't enough to convince Mr. Handsome Danny, on account of Handsome kept right on trying to outtalk me.

"Fatty," he said, "I really think you're washed up, and if you were as intelligent as you say you are, you would know it's time for you to quit posing as a pool player."

"Intelligent?" I screamed. "Listen, sonny boy, I'll tell you how intelligent I am-I could spot Einstein the 10 ball.


Gotta love that Fatman:D
 

Island Drive

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Dowell IL

Dowell IL

These are great, Island Drive! Thank you for having gone to the effort to do this interview back when you could, and thank you for sharing it with us now!!!

Thx,

It was a hoot meeting with er and doin' the shoot on 2-28-96. We had a good time doing the bio of her life with em. Enough so she asked me if I'd stay for dinner....of course. Before I knew it, she put me together and I realized the fridge was freshly stocked, I was cooking and then I cleaned up the entire kitchen Should of recorded our meal, but she was proud and on meds and could be sloppy with food So outta respect, she demanded it in a good way, and during dinner she said I could use the extra bedroom for a nights lay over....
 

Alfie Taylor

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Doc, you pretty much nailed it with every line, including Danny Di's opinion (and probably George Rood's opinion, too -- although he isn't as outspoken as Danny).

Dick, You are right about Squirrel and Beenie being influential in getting George Jansco to hold a One Pocket tournament, but you have your facts wrong about RA -- he was not a factor at Johnston City until later. Cokes would have been another pre-tournament Johnston City guy, along with Taylor & probably Schriver. I do not know for sure about either of the "Reds", but I have my doubts about Jersey Red anyway.



Another thing that is a plus for Fats in my opinion is that when he came out with his own rule book, it not only included One Pocket, it featured it right on the cover! Contrary to Mike Shamos's article on the history of One Pocket, Fats' rule book was out about a year before the BCA deigned to include One Pocket in their rule book (oh, dear, it is a gambling game :D )

Here's another question for you. The Hustler movie opened the door, but it took Fats to turn the character into the most unforgettable name in pool. Just for example, several other players back then tried to get traction with the "Fast Eddie" moniker -- including RA. You are a big RA fan; well try explaining why a true character, (and better player than Fats) could not get near as much traction with "Fast Eddie" name as Rudy did with the "Minnesota Fats" name? Big, big difference.

I never saw Fats, but there is no question that he was a huge early and loud promoter of the game of One Pocket.

The fact that Minnesota Fats is still the most contraversial name in the sport should count for something. I knew him as more of a man than a hustler...and, a good man at that.But, as for who the two characters in Tevis' movie are about, I have to agree that Fats just hooked his wagon onto a star and made it brighter. And, Fats never hurt anyone. But, I have a cincinatti newspaper all about Toby Kavenaugh's pool room wheer Tevis hung out to learn things about pool and hustlers from Toby. Toby was murdered but he left one wall in his pool room covered with Eddie Taylor memorbelia as a tribute to Taylor's influence as the "Fast Eddie" character. Now, unless someone wants to call a dead man a liar, this about settles one question.

"In my opinion Minnesota Fats did more for pool than anyone ever"
Eddie "the Knoxville Bear" Taylor
Do you put downers know what RIP stands for? Do you know the value of sweet words?
Keep it civil. Alfie
 

Island Drive

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Hookin' up

Hookin' up

The fact that Minnesota Fats is still the most contraversial name in the sport should count for something. I knew him as more of a man than a hustler...and, a good man at that.But, as for who the two characters in Tevis' movie are about, I have to agree that Fats just hooked his wagon onto a star and made it brighter. And, Fats never hurt anyone. But, I have a cincinatti newspaper all about Toby Kavenaugh's pool room wheer Tevis hung out to learn things about pool and hustlers from Toby. Toby was murdered but he left one wall in his pool room covered with Eddie Taylor memorbelia as a tribute to Taylor's influence as the "Fast Eddie" character. Now, unless someone wants to call a dead man a liar, this about settles one question.

"In my opinion Minnesota Fats did more for pool than anyone ever"
Eddie "the Knoxville Bear" Taylor
Do you put downers know what RIP stands for? Do you know the value of sweet words?
Keep it civil. Alfie


Fats and Ev are now alone for the first time;

While eating my steak, ‘’I thought I was into something Big’’ is was Evelyn said….so finally ‘’we got rid of the Greek’’ and I don’t know, at this time it musta been midnight, there was no place to go, and I’m thinking (ev’s words) we went to Carbondale not a motel but a Hotel, an Old Hotel there, there wasn’t any better hotel there, but it was an ‘’old timer’’, and I guess he checked us in as man and wife, and you know the rest of the story.
 

Billy Jackets

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Does anyone on this site have any information on how good Fats played in the 30s and 40s? That "short-timer" in the pool world guy, CJ#1 certainly doesnt. He thinks "doggin it" means to trying to outrun the dog in somebody's yard when you are trying to deliver a package. To give a good example, he didnt know me and he didnt know Artie.:sorry

Fats played Chicago Pony Rosen 8 to 7 in Bensingers in the 30s and 40s. Eddie Taylor player Pony with the same game! Those games of course were on a big table 5 x 10. The only people to spot Pony more than that was Rags Fitzpatrick and Tommy the Greek (same guy who wound up on 4th and Main). Rags played Pony, and won, with 8 to 7 and the break. Tommy the Greek played Pony 8 to 6. In 1969, 1970, 71 or 72, at 4th and Main, Tommy the Greek played Eddie Taylor even 1pkt for $100 a game to a 24 hour draw. Tommy was at least 70 at the time.

The above is what one would call a "real" statistic, not some fantasy, hoped-for estimate by someone who is not qualified to hold an opinion.

Beard

Would you agree that Fats 9 ball game was about 9 to 7 weaker than his 1 Pocket?
Also, did you ever see him play 3 cushion?
I know he had Erich Hagenlacher as a teacher but I never hear of him playing the game.
 

fred bentivegna

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Would you agree that Fats 9 ball game was about 9 to 7 weaker than his 1 Pocket?
Also, did you ever see him play 3 cushion?
I know he had Erich Hagenlacher as a teacher but I never hear of him playing the game.

Fats was near helpless playing 9-ball, not so playing three-cushion. Eddie Robin bullied him into playing a game to 50 for $500 at the Michigan State Fair Grounds in 1963. Fats ran 9 and out to leave Eddie in the one-hole. Robin has conveniently forgotten this incident ever occurred, and now denies it vehemently. My old editor, Randi Givens was there to sweat it.

Beard
 

tylerdurden

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Fats was near helpless playing 9-ball, not so playing three-cushion. Eddie Robin bullied him into playing a game to 50 for $500 at the Michigan State Fair Grounds in 1963. Fats ran 9 and out to leave Eddie in the one-hole. Robin has conveniently forgotten this incident ever occurred, and now denies it vehemently. My old editor, Randi Givens was there to sweat it.

Beard

THAT is a good story. Sincerely.

Cheers.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Fats was near helpless playing 9-ball, not so playing three-cushion. Eddie Robin bullied him into playing a game to 50 for $500 at the Michigan State Fair Grounds in 1963. Fats ran 9 and out to leave Eddie in the one-hole. Robin has conveniently forgotten this incident ever occurred, and now denies it vehemently. My old editor, Randi Givens was there to sweat it.

Beard

Freddy,

Was this the Michigan State Fair where I didn't book a loser?:).

http://www.onepocket.org/forum/showthread.php?t=5820

Dennis
 

Alfie Taylor

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Never mind dick

Never mind dick

I think some wires got crossed, this was sent to me. It should have been sent to SJD.


Well thanks Dick, I think this thread has gotten bogged down and thought it needed some new life injected into it. I hope that this pic helps.

P.S. Dick, thanks for friday night. xoxoxo's

Love Jenna

View attachment 439


Dennis. I don't know what your pic. did for Dick, but it made my morning. Thanks. I owe you two.
Keep it buxom. Alfie
 

Island Drive

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Evelyn

Evelyn

So I had a date with him for the next night, then the next , and dated him from March 7th and married on the 7th of May. Now I had known him just two weeks. And ahhh, we’re at the eatery, the nightclub the Evening Star, oh and he had me quit my job ‘’right away’’, but he wanted Me to be wherever he was, be with him. He had a phone call, it was almost 11 o’clock at night……………………..
 

Alfie Taylor

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Richard my friend...

Richard my friend...

If you can find one post, where I "bashed" Fatty, either as a humanitarian, or a real, icon of pool...I will buy you a new Rolex. (fake copy of course)

Most of the posts I've made, re; Fat's, deal with his actual skill level, and are in response to my main adversary, and thus become an effort to try and piss HIM off... Do not think I did not enjoy Fat's schtick,...like everyone else.

The only other area I have dealt with, was how he BECAME "Minnesota Fats" and I know you are way to intelligent to not understand, that it's not a knock on him..Just the simple truth...:cool:

So get off my case, you big bully, or I may "unfriend" you...JK JK JK JK :p :p

NOTE;..If I forget to add "JK" and "smiley faces",..when I joke with the B***d, he goes into spastic convulsions, and calls me very hurtful names..:(..Do I have to do the same thing with m' best bud ? :confused:

PS..As usual, you did not "QUOTE" anyone, as I advised....So I have to ASSUME you were "talking to me"..

View attachment 5561

You will know when I am addressing you: I will begin with "Mr McMorran...and heavy on the "mister". Kapeech? (Did I spell that correctly? I'm Scotch-Irish). Let's go to Vegas again and show them what the "over the hill gang" is made of.
Whattatheyno? Keep it active. Alfie
 
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