B. Shuff vs. S.V.B. 2012 D.C.C.

Cowboy Dennis

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A monster shot that I first seen when Babyface shot it in Johnston City, is Bank the 11 ball into about 1 1/4 diamond up from the corner. With a hard draw stroke and left hand english, pull the cue ball into about 1 1/2 diamonds up from the opposite corner pocket. The cue ball will contact the long rail and then spring down to the opposite long rail and up table. The 11 ball will crash into the side of the rack and anything could happen, all of it good.

Beard

Something like this Fred? Not a bad idea. You'll definitely move a lot of balls towards your pocket.

Fred's shot1.jpg

Just don't forget that something can always go wrong when you hit balls with speed into the stack. Things like this:

Fred's shot2.jpg

Always a possibility.
 

Tom Wirth

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Sorry Tom, that's not a true statement. After banking the 9, there are at least two shots to move lots of balls over. also after banking the 9 there's no way the combo is on for your opponent.

Hey Jim,
Look again at the situation and you will see from up table should he bank the nine, miss it so the cue ball is on the side rail the nine would have to be hit with some speed. The nine ball will in all likelyhood go back up table. From this position there is a return shot which needs consideration. It is a three ball combo; five ball, (in any case the ball slightly above the foot spot) fourteen, four. The cue ball can easily be controled to the side rail and lay up very near the twelve. If this shot falls it's light out! If on the nine ball shot the cue ball gets away from the side rail the combo on the seven-fifteen becomes a viable shot to consider. Another option would be a clearing shot. For these reasons and the possible loss of momentum I would stay away from the nine ball shot playing top players.

The fifteen ball bank back toward the six is a serious consideration but I don't see enough angle to send the cue ball to the top rail and back down to the side pocket area without hitting the shot very hard. If I can play that shot with moderate speed and get the cue ball in a safe position I might just go for that.

Tom
 

jtompilot

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Hey Jim,
Look again at the situation and you will see from up table should he bank the nine, miss it so the cue ball is on the side rail the nine would have to be hit with some speed. The nine ball will in all likelyhood go back up table. From this position there is a return shot which needs consideration. It is a three ball combo; five ball, (in any case the ball slightly above the foot spot) fourteen, four. The cue ball can easily be controled to the side rail and lay up very near the twelve. If this shot falls it's light out! If on the nine ball shot the cue ball gets away from the side rail the combo on the seven-fifteen becomes a viable shot to consider. Another option would be a clearing shot. For these reasons and the possible loss of momentum I would stay away from the nine ball shot playing top players.

The fifteen ball bank back toward the six is a serious consideration but I don't see enough angle to send the cue ball to the top rail and back down to the side pocket area without hitting the shot very hard. If I can play that shot with moderate speed and get the cue ball in a safe position I might just go for that.

Tom

Tom, I set the shot up ten times. I havent played in two weeks so I'm a little rusty. The first shot I hung the 9 but most of the times I over cut the 9. I really butchered two of them. Eight of them I left the Q ball at 2 1/4 diamonds from the corner and 3/4 diamonds from the side rail. At no time did the 9 bounce off the foot rail. From the Q ball placement at 2 1/4 diamonds you cant see a cross bank. If the 9 goes in your in great shape.
 

Tom Wirth

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Tom, I set the shot up ten times. I havent played in two weeks so I'm a little rusty. The first shot I hung the 9 but most of the times I over cut the 9. I really butchered two of them. Eight of them I left the Q ball at 2 1/4 diamonds from the corner and 3/4 diamonds from the side rail. At no time did the 9 bounce off the foot rail. From the Q ball placement at 2 1/4 diamonds you cant see a cross bank. If the 9 goes in your in great shape.

Not bad Jim.
Try the safety shot I proposed. What would you do from that position?
 

androd

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Another version of Beards shot. Hope I don't scratch in the side. :)
Rod.
P.S. Whatever ball you hit here it'll be good. Just make sure you hit something. It'll look like a jailbreak.:D
 

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usblues

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I'm reminded.....

I'm reminded.....

......of one of your old lines Freddie, when you say when your doing commentary, where you say "He wouldn't shoot that shot if you put a gun to his head".I'm talking about Artie shooting your shot of course,cheers,James
 

tylerdurden

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Tom, I set the shot up ten times. I havent played in two weeks so I'm a little rusty. The first shot I hung the 9 but most of the times I over cut the 9. I really butchered two of them. Eight of them I left the Q ball at 2 1/4 diamonds from the corner and 3/4 diamonds from the side rail. At no time did the 9 bounce off the foot rail. From the Q ball placement at 2 1/4 diamonds you cant see a cross bank. If the 9 goes in your in great shape.

That 2 1/4 diamonds is probably on kinda sticky, old cloth though? I usually assume these matches are on new, slidy cloth. In any case, nice reporting.... I'd love to report some of these shots but I am NEVER at a table anymore. Woes me :(
 

wincardona

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A monster shot that I first seen when Babyface shot it in Johnston City, is Bank the 11 ball into about 1 1/4 diamond up from the corner. With a hard draw stroke and left hand english, pull the cue ball into about 1 1/2 diamonds up from the opposite corner pocket. The cue ball will contact the long rail and then spring down to the opposite long rail and up table. The 11 ball will crash into the side of the rack and anything could happen, all of it good.

Beard

Dont tell Dr Bill this shot
The shot you described is a creative way to control the cue ball when the natural path is congested , however, in this diagram the natural path for the shot (the shot Rodney drew up )
Is available so why would you want to complcate the shot and shoot it by drawing the cue ball? Plus the angle needed for your shot doesn't look to be there.:sorry hope I didn't hurt your feelings. Couldn't resist, haven't ruffled your feathers in a while.

Dr. Bill
 

fred bentivegna

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The shot you described is a creative way to control the cue ball when the natural path is congested , however, in this diagram the natural path for the shot (the shot Rodney drew up )
Is available so why would you want to complcate the shot and shoot it by drawing the cue ball? Plus the angle needed for your shot doesn't look to be there.:sorry hope I didn't hurt your feelings. Couldn't resist, haven't ruffled your feathers in a while.

Dr. Bill

Rodney's shot is just fine. The optimum position for my shot is when the cue ball and the object ball are a little closer to the long rail; that makes the draw action much easier.

Beard
 

NH Steve

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I'm banking the 9 ball with high right and good speed.

My intention is to make the 9 and get the cue ball up near the side pocket. I am not lagging the bank.

The shot is only good if you get the cue ball near the side pocket. If you don't and you miss the bank you have lost the advantage of hiding the balls near your pocket.

The cue ball is really the important part of this shot.

Bill S.
As I look at the 9-ball bank, hitting it with high right would hold the cue ball down close to that far end rail, not bring it back up toward the side pocket :confused:
 

Cowboy Dennis

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It looks like the 9 or the 10 both have side boards. The 9 looks like it would potentially cause a nasty carom on the 10 if you tried to bank the 10 directly into your pocket, but off the 11 would give you lots of extra room to bank even the 10 ball straight back.

I can't belive that nobody else mentioned banking the 10 into the 11 or 12 balls. You can hit it in the face and control the cueball better. The balls by your pocket are hidden now and you may even make the ball.

It's the shot SVB chose:

svb's shot2.jpg


He did tie up his pocket though:(:

svb's shot1.jpg
 

Tom Wirth

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Interesting choice. I don't see the value in banking the ten as opposed to the nine here unless SVB thought by banking the nine he might very well get a double kiss. The same approximate cue ball position can be reached with either shot but the nine ball had better potential for falling.

BTW, SVB must have hit that ten ball so soft that after hitting the twelve it never reached the back rail but simply died right there. Now he has given up the two railer on the nine and will have to play safe from up table toward Shuffs pocket.

Tom
 

petie

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Interesting choice. I don't see the value in banking the ten as opposed to the nine here unless SVB thought by banking the nine he might very well get a double kiss. The same approximate cue ball position can be reached with either shot but the nine ball had better potential for falling.

BTW, SVB must have hit that ten ball so soft that after hitting the twelve it never reached the back rail but simply died right there. Now he has given up the two railer on the nine and will have to play safe from up table toward Shuffs pocket.

Tom

Every shot does not have to score. You can often help yourself more by putting your oppo in a pickle. Great moves create unforced errors. These in turn lead to scoring opportunities. He played off the stripe to get whitie in the right place. He gets the bonus of another ball in scoring position.
 

wincardona

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Interesting choice. I don't see the value in banking the ten as opposed to the nine here unless SVB thought by banking the nine he might very well get a double kiss. The same approximate cue ball position can be reached with either shot but the nine ball had better potential for falling.

BTW, SVB must have hit that ten ball so soft that after hitting the twelve it never reached the back rail but simply died right there. Now he has given up the two railer on the nine and will have to play safe from up table toward Shuffs pocket.

Tom

You're correct Tom the 9 ball was too difficult of a hit to control cue ball off of. The double kiss was certainly there. The 10ball was a much better ball to bank because of the hit being more predictable both in terms of controlling the cue ball and also the object ball. I believe Steve mentioned the 10ball being an option, I looked at it and also likef it but didn't think there was enough room to bank it comfortably enough to avoid hitting the 9ball with it. Angles are sometimes difficult to predict.

Dr. Bill
 

tylerdurden

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You're correct Tom the 9 ball was too difficult of a hit to control cue ball off of. The double kiss was certainly there. The 10ball was a much better ball to bank because of the hit being more predictable both in terms of controlling the cue ball and also the object ball. I believe Steve mentioned the 10ball being an option, I looked at it and also likef it but didn't think there was enough room to bank it comfortably enough to avoid hitting the 9ball with it. Angles are sometimes difficult to predict.

Dr. Bill

I don't like it because if you clip that 9 you are going to look like you are shooting for the other guy's hole real easy. He shoots straight enough though, so more power to him. I would not consider that myself.... the 9 is too close.
 

Jimmy B

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I don't like it because if you clip that 9 you are going to look like you are shooting for the other guy's hole real easy. He shoots straight enough though, so more power to him. I would not consider that myself.... the 9 is too close.


He did one like that against Reyes the other night
 

wincardona

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Every shot does not have to score. You can often help yourself more by putting your oppo in a pickle. Great moves create unforced errors. These in turn lead to scoring opportunities. He played off the stripe to get whitie in the right place. He gets the bonus of another ball in scoring position.

You are absolutely correct with your statement. The cue ball in this instance was a major concern of Shane's the deciding factor in choosing the option. Another example of the advantages for a top ball striker like Shane as he was comfortable with the hit in spite of the 9balls presence.

Dr. Bill
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Every shot does not have to score. You can often help yourself more by putting your oppo in a pickle. Great moves create unforced errors. These in turn lead to scoring opportunities. He played off the stripe to get whitie in the right place. He gets the bonus of another ball in scoring position.

Actually Petie, if you look at the layout objectively, you'll see that he tied up his pocket and now neither ball is in scoring position. Shuff is now free to do pretty much whatever he wants.

Dennis
 
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