One Ball One Pocket

[NH Steve]

You get into some LSD or sumtin in houston........................straight OP is hard enough........

Haha — not lately, however I am old enough that I might have when I was young and foolish 50-something years ago ....if only I could remember

 

[NH Steve]

I got a call from Harry Platis today, because somebody told him there was something about rules for One Ball One Pocket here, and he said he a game and wanted to be sure about the rules. I asked him if he had played it before and he said yes, he had played Marshall Carpenter a lot of it. I asked if he remembered if he and Squirrel had spotted a ball on a scratch or foul and he said yes. So I sent him that version of the rules, but I also mentioned the Sudden Death version. We'll see what happens....

 

[vapros]

I'm astounded! 243 posts in two weeks about a game played with just one object ball. Not complaining, just noting. One pocket should be so fascinating.

 

[lll]

Here’s another version
talked to my house pro today who’s from Oklahoma
he said the way he played it back then was
if you scratched or fouled you had to make the object ball twice
when you made it in your pocket it got spotted back frozen to the middle diamond on the foot rail
meaning there is always only one ball on the table

 

[sheldon]

I got a call from Harry Platis today, because somebody told him there was something about rules for One Ball One Pocket here, and he said he a game and wanted to be sure about the rules. I asked him if he had played it before and he said yes, he had played Marshall Carpenter a lot of it. I asked if he remembered if he and Squirrel had spotted a ball on a scratch or foul and he said yes. So I sent him that version of the rules, but I also mentioned the Sudden Death version. We'll see what happens....

This is the reason it's a good idea to have an official set of rules! So when someone wants to match up and the other person can't agree on rules, you can point them to something that might settle arguments, or feelings that someone is trying to rig the rules in their favor.

 

[NH Steve]

I am content with the two versions that most of us have settled on -- the most common version being the equivalent of starting a game with the ball count 7-7 and playing 100% standard One Pocket from there. The other, with a significant dissenting opinion, being "Sudden Death", beginning the same way, but if you scratch or foul it is a loss of game. We may need to clarify that even playing Sudden Death, pocketing the object ball in a neutral pocket it just spots as in standard One Pocket -- it is not loss of game -- based on the variant reported from the Expo one year. The differences that continue to float around seem to mainly relate to the break. However, everyone seems to agree that the break is supposed to be a defensive shot to get the game going, without being able to win on it.

 

[NH Steve]

Here’s another version
talked to my house pro today who’s from Oklahoma
he said the way he played it back then was
if you scratched or fouled you had to make the object ball twice
when you made it in your pocket it got spotted back frozen to the middle diamond on the foot rail
meaning there is always only one ball on the table

That came up earlier too. The issue with it is, it runs contrary to how spotted balls are handled in standard One Pocket. We do not want rules for the One Ball version potentially leaking confusion into the rules for standard One Pocket. How balls are spotted in One Pocket used to be a major area of confusion because before we introduced standard One Pocket rules here. Before 2004 there were no written rules that covered that, because all prior written One Pocket rule sets were overly simple, and did not cover a number of common One Pocket situations -- that being one. Another one used to be how/whether balls made in the opponent's pocket stayed down or came up and were spotted on what kind of fouls or scratches.

Any of those earlier areas of confusion about One Pocket rules, if you ask me, are especially to be steered clear of when we offer up standardized rules for the One Ball version/s of One Pocket.

So that makes yet another priority for these rules for me:

• Setting rules that make/keep the game inviting to play, because it may act as a gateway for new players to standard One Pocket
• Making/keeping it an attractive gambling/tournament/competition game to play
• Not conflicting with standard One Pocket rules as much as possible, to avoid confusion seeping into standard One Pocket
• Keeping these rules as simple as possible, befitting a game with one ball and one pocket

 

[lll]

Since the rules you posted way back are the way a vast majority play
I like them

 

[NH Steve]

One Ball One Pocket

An abbreviated form of One Pocket, beginning with just one object ball on the table.

Basic Rules:
1. Begin with one ball frozen to the center of the foot rail, B-I-H from the kitchen.
2. Breaker must open wth a defensive shot.
3. Standard One Pocket rules of play from there.

Definitions & Options:
Legal Break: If the opening break leaves the object ball within one diamond of the breaker's own pocket, the opponent has the option of accepting the balls as they lie and continuing play, or calling for a re-break. Repeated calls for a re-break may result in an official warning. Repeated calls for a re-break by the same player after a warning may result in the acting official declaring loss of game.

Score Keeping: Unless the game is “Sudden Death”, prior to beginning play, the other 14 object balls are placed in their usual scoring trays and spotted as needed on the foot spot as in a standard game of One Pocket beginning with a 7-7 score, to avoid scoring and foul limit disputes.

“Sudden Death” One Ball One Pocket: Played the same as above, except any scratch or foul is an immediate loss of game. Note: There is no penalty for pocketing the object ball in a neutral pocket; it simply spots on the foot spot and play continues.

 

[gulfportdoc]

I got a call from Harry Platis today, because somebody told him there was something about rules for One Ball One Pocket here, and he said he a game and wanted to be sure about the rules. I asked him if he had played it before and he said yes, he had played Marshall Carpenter a lot of it. I asked if he remembered if he and Squirrel had spotted a ball on a scratch or foul and he said yes. So I sent him that version of the rules, but I also mentioned the Sudden Death version. We'll see what happens....

There you go, Steve. Even the sickest of gamblers want to know the rules....

 

[LSJohn]

One Ball One Pocket

An abbreviated form of One Pocket, beginning with just one object ball on the table.

Basic Rules:
1. Begin with one ball frozen to the center of the foot rail, B-I-H from the kitchen.
2. Breaker must open wth a defensive shot.
3. Standard One Pocket rules of play from there.

Definitions & Options:
Legal Break: If the opening break leaves the object ball within one diamond of the breaker's own pocket, the opponent has the option of accepting the balls as they lie and continuing play, or calling for a re-break. Repeated calls for a re-break may result in an official warning. Repeated calls for a re-break by the same player after a warning may result in the acting official declaring loss of game.

Score Keeping: Unless the game is “Sudden Death”, prior to beginning play, the other 14 object balls are placed in their usual scoring trays and spotted as needed on the foot spot as in a standard game of One Pocket beginning with a 7-7 score, to avoid scoring and foul limit disputes.

“Sudden Death” One Ball One Pocket: Played the same as above, except any scratch or foul is an immediate loss of game. Note: There is no penalty for pocketing the object ball in a neutral pocket; it simply spots on the foot spot and play continues.

I would eliminate the final two sentences under "Legal Break."

 

[darmoose]

I would eliminate the final two sentences under "Legal Break."

I would agree.................and I would eliminate the verbage about placing 14 balls in the rack. You need to decide if there is a 3 foul rule in play or not, and if there is any limit to the number of balls that can be on the table.

I understand that at present you are not limiting the balls on the table, but you are not addressing the 3 foul rule, so you may want to think about it. I wouldn't bring this up except that I know you are trying to mimmick OP as much as possible...........

 

[BRLongArm]

I suggest that for tournament play, 3 foul rule is a must. Gamblers can do what they want.

 

[lll]

I would agree.................and I would eliminate the verbage about placing 14 balls in the rack. You need to decide if there is a 3 foul rule in play or not, and if there is any limit to the number of balls that can be on the table.

I understand that at present you are not limiting the balls on the table, but you are not addressing the 3 foul rule, so you may want to think about it. I wouldn't bring this up except that I know you are trying to mimmick OP as much as possible...........

i think rule #3
3. Standard One Pocket rules of play from there.
would address the 3 foul rule
ie the players decide before they start
or its decided before the tournament begins
just like regular one pocket

 

[lll]

I suggest that for tournament play, 3 foul rule is a must. Gamblers can do what they want.

i think that could be decided at a players meeting or the tournament director decides
rather than dictate it for tournaments
btw
i think it should always be how you play

 

[NH Steve]

i think rule #3
3. Standard One Pocket rules of play from there.
would address the 3 foul rule
ie the players decide before they start
or its decided before the tournament begins
just like regular one pocket

Yes, the 3 foul rule falls under "standard One Pocket" for sure.

I would agree.................and I would eliminate the verbage about placing 14 balls in the rack. You need to decide if there is a 3 foul rule in play or not, and if there is any limit to the number of balls that can be on the table.

I understand that at present you are not limiting the balls on the table, but you are not addressing the 3 foul rule, so you may want to think about it. I wouldn't bring this up except that I know you are trying to mimmick OP as much as possible...........

I put that in there because several posters commented on the question of golly gee, how do you keep score if you are spotting up balls? The answer is simple, just like standard One Pocket when it comes down to the last ball. It's not in the "rules" -- it's in the addendum that -- based on the comments in this thread -- some of which is only basically necessary for nits, anglers, old farts and maybe TD's lol.

You are right in pointing out that the only version with foul limits that I included above is the "Sudden Death" version. That is because I did not hear a lot of support in this thread for other limits, such as the one I first proposed of no more than two balls on the table for any player, or the next foul/scratch would be loss of game. And the Sudden Death version is certainly a LOT EASIER to define and explain than a limit of 2 or more balls per player. So I began to think those other options were unnecessary. Of course as you are well aware, players can agree to play however they want -- unless they are in a tournament that specifies obviously.

I would eliminate the final two sentences under "Legal Break."

That's also why I put a TD's option if they get a stubborn player taking advantage if there is no actual penalty for multiple re-breaks. Everybody else can just ignore that because it would, as you essentially are saying, be unnecessary.

That said, I am still listening, so please keep the comments coming -- everybody -- even if all you want to say echoes what somebody else already said. In fact that tells me that more than one person is concerned about that particular point. So keep the comments coming.

 

[Tobermory]

One Ball One Pocket

An abbreviated form of One Pocket, beginning with just one object ball on the table.

Basic Rules:
1. Begin with one ball frozen to the center of the foot rail, B-I-H from the kitchen.
2. Breaker must open wth a defensive shot.
3. Standard One Pocket rules of play from there.

Definitions & Options:
Legal Break: If the opening break leaves the object ball within one diamond of the breaker's own pocket, the opponent has the option of accepting the balls as they lie and continuing play, or calling for a re-break. Repeated calls for a re-break may result in an official warning. Repeated calls for a re-break by the same player after a warning may result in the acting official declaring loss of game.

Score Keeping: Unless the game is “Sudden Death”, prior to beginning play, the other 14 object balls are placed in their usual scoring trays and spotted as needed on the foot spot as in a standard game of One Pocket beginning with a 7-7 score, to avoid scoring and foul limit disputes.

“Sudden Death” One Ball One Pocket: Played the same as above, except any scratch or foul is an immediate loss of game. Note: There is no penalty for pocketing the object ball in a neutral pocket; it simply spots on the foot spot and play continues.

Legal break: I'm fine with a rule that requires the breaker to leave the object ball more than a diamond away from the breaker's pocket, but the two sentences imposing warnings and loss of game are heavy handed and unneeded. Any player who keeps doing it, each time giving their opponent a choice whether to keep what might be an advantageous situation or make him break again, only punishes themselves. No need for additional sanctions.

Score Keeping: the language about the other 14 object balls is confusing and superfluous. How does this clarify anything? If the game is sudden death, aren't the other 14 balls left in their usual scoring trays, too? If the point is to explain something about the consequence of fouls, all you need to say is what you said in Post #1, the rule applied at Buffalos: "In the event of a scratch or foul, the offending player spots up an additional ball, and play continues with the offending player now needing two balls for the win."

Thanks.

 

[Ratamon]

Yes, the 3 foul rule falls under "standard One Pocket" for sure.

That’s a different 3 foul rule. In 1b1p the three fouls don’t necessarily need to be committed consecutively. You may end up needing more than 3 balls if there is a legal shot in between the fouls. So I think a separate rule may be required if we want this complication, that is.

 

[LSJohn]

Yes, the 3 foul rule falls under "standard One Pocket" for sure.


I put that in there because several posters commented on the question of golly gee, how do you keep score if you are spotting up balls? The answer is simple, just like standard One Pocket when it comes down to the last ball. It's not in the "rules" -- it's in the addendum that -- based on the comments in this thread -- some of which is only basically necessary for nits, anglers, old farts and maybe TD's lol.

You are right in pointing out that the only version with foul limits that I included above is the "Sudden Death" version. That is because I did not hear a lot of support in this thread for other limits, such as the one I first proposed of no more than two balls on the table for any player, or the next foul/scratch would be loss of game. And the Sudden Death version is certainly a LOT EASIER to define and explain than a limit of 2 or more balls per player. So I began to think those other options were unnecessary. Of course as you are well aware, players can agree to play however they want -- unless they are in a tournament that specifies obviously.


That's also why I put a TD's option if they get a stubborn player taking advantage if there is no actual penalty for multiple re-breaks. Everybody else can just ignore that because it would, as you essentially are saying, be unnecessary.

That said, I am still listening, so please keep the comments coming -- everybody -- even if all you want to say echoes what somebody else already said. In fact that tells me that more than one person is concerned about that particular point. So keep the comments coming.

"That's also why I put a TD's option if they get a stubborn player taking advantage..."

I was under the impression that it's an option that TDs always have.

 

[NH Steve]

That’s a different 3 foul rule. In 1b1p they don’t necessarily need to be committed on 3 consecutive shots. You may end up needing more than 3 balls if there is a legal shot in between the fouls. So I think a separate rule may be required?

Yes, you are talking about limiting fouls -- to a maximum number of balls on the table per player. Way up top in my first post I included setting an optional limit. But the feedback in the this thread indicated the most popular foul limiting option was "Sudden Death" -- zero extra balls allowed. Here it is below, where it would limit each player to a maximum of two balls at any one time on the table. If they scratch or foul when they already have two on the table, that would be loss of game. That is a little more forgiving than Sudden Death, and you add in some of the nice complexities of strategy that come with 2-3 balls on the table.

If there is support for this option, I can put it back in, but as an additional option, not to replace Sudden Death, because clearly Sudden Death has a camp that is going to play that way no matter what rules we adopt

This is what it said:

Optional:
4. Needing 3 is loss of game: To avoid longer games due to extra scratches, in the event that a player already needs two balls (due to an earlier scratch or foul not yet repaid), any additional scratch or foul that would normally result in that player needing three balls to win, instead results in loss of game. If this rule is in place, the scratches or fouls do not need to be “in a row”, so no warning is necessary.