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  #21  
Old 04-25-2015, 09:53 AM
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jrhendy jrhendy is online now
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Originally Posted by darmoose View Post
Assuming that the 9ball does clear the 6ball on a straight full hit, which allows you to follow with the CB a path which puts it behind the 13 and 1balls, why would anyone want to shoot the 4ball, travel the CB 4 rails (some 18-20 ft) to get to the same place?

If you believe the 9ball does not clear the 6ball, then simply allow the 9ball to carem off the 6ball and travel across the table (providing uptable protection) ,while the CB still travels to a position behind the 13 and 1balls.

This shot is exponentially easier and more reliable than the 4 rail option while achieving the same or better result. Whatever happened to KISS??
Because it is a SYSTEM shot. You spend all that time learning them, you need to use them.
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  #22  
Old 04-25-2015, 10:17 AM
LSJohn LSJohn is offline
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Originally Posted by jrhendy View Post
Because it is a SYSTEM shot. You spend all that time learning them, you need to use them.
I know you're half (or more ) joking, but maybe the SYSTEM can offer preciseness to put you under the 1 (I doubt it) but it looks to me that if you hit anywhere between 1/4 and 1/2 of the four with 9 o'clock -- any stroke -- and the right speed, you can't avoid ending behind the 1-13.
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  #23  
Old 04-25-2015, 10:37 AM
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mr3cushion mr3cushion is offline
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Originally Posted by jrhendy View Post
Because it is a SYSTEM shot. You spend all that time learning them, you need to use them.
John; You are mostly correct, whether jokingly or not! My intention was to show a viable 'correct system' and 'technique' for these types of escapes when the OB is frozen to the first cushion!

Jimmy Reid who has been a long time friend and was hanging around Chicago in the late 60's early 70's at Bensingers. Jimmy was always fascinated with 3C, and loved to bang them around with me and talk about different systems and techniques for CB control to incorporate into Pool!

He's the one that first setup the layout in my diagram, using the info I provided Him on occasions playing 3C!

Don't get me wrong, there are 'other' options, this was just one of them that appeals to me for many reasons. And with a little practice and the 'correct' info other's may too!

Many Billiard and Pool players when approaching to play THIS type of shot that use a 'Diamond' system use the WRONG one! They instinctively go right to the, '5 Corner' system, this would be fine if, 'the CB was 4 or 5 inches from the first cushion! But, the OB is 'frozen' in this example, without manufacturing a angle the CB can ONLY contact the cushion a inch or two on the rail from where it already lies! Plus, we're really Only interested in a 'natural angle' from the 2nd and 3rd rails to the 4th! hence forth, the 'Plus 2' system is FAR more accurate for calculating this type of shot mathematically!

About the technique needed for the BEST results. If a player uses a 'normal' follow-thru, with the CB frozen to the rail, it will cause a 'wide angle' carom! The CB will contact the 2nd rail somewhat closer to the center diamond on the short cushion, which would most likely scratch or hit the 9 ball! By using a 'short or jab' stoke (less the length of the bridge) we can make a clean hit on the OB and create the angle without speed or draw on the CB! This is a 'standard' technique when trying to create a shorter than normal angle going 3, 4 or 5 cushions when the OB is frozen or nearly frozen to the first rail!

Last edited by mr3cushion; 04-25-2015 at 05:03 PM.
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  #24  
Old 04-25-2015, 10:54 AM
wincardona wincardona is offline
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Originally Posted by mr3cushion View Post


John; You are mostly correct, whether jokingly or not! My intention was to show a viable 'correct system' and 'technique' for these types of escapes when the OB is frozen to the first cushion!

Jimmy Reid who has been a long time friend and was hanging around Chicago in the late 60's early 70's at Bensingers. Jimmy was always fascinated with 3C, and loved to bang them around with me and talk about different systems and techniques for CB control to incorporate into Pool!

He's the one that first setup the layout in my diagram, using the info I provided Him on occasions playing 3C!

Don't get me wrong, there are 'other' options, this was just one of them that appeals to me for many reasons. And with a little practice and the 'correct' info other's may too!

Many Billiard and Pool players when approaching to play THIS type of shot that use a 'Diamond' system use the WRONG one! They instinctively go right to the, '5 Corner' system, this would be fine if, 'the CB was 4 or 5 inches from the first cushion! But, the CB is 'frozen' in this example, without manufacturing a angle the CB can ONLY contact the cushion a inch or two on the rail from where it already lies! Plus, we're really Only interested in a 'natural angle' from the 2nd and 3rd rails to the 4th! hence forth, the 'Plus 2' system is FAR more accurate for calculating this type of shot mathematically!

About the technique needed for the BEST results. If a player uses a 'normal' follow-thru, with the CB frozen to the rail, it will cause a 'wide angle' carom! The CB will contact the 2nd rail somewhat closer to the center diamond on the short cushion, which would most likely scratch or hit the 9 ball! By using a 'short or jab' stoke (less the length of the bridge) we can make a clean hit on the OB and create the angle without speed or draw on the CB! This is a 'standard' technique when trying to create a shorter than normal angle going 3, 4 or 5 cushions when the OB is frozen or nearly frozen to the first rail!
Maybe he's serious about what he said and is encouraging players to exercise the lesson, I would like to think so.
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Bill
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  #25  
Old 04-25-2015, 11:03 AM
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mr3cushion mr3cushion is offline
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Originally Posted by wincardona View Post
Maybe he's serious about what he said and is encouraging players to exercise the lesson, I would like to think so.
Dr
Bill
I certainly hope so Billy, I'm just trying to help players that want to learn some proven methods that I've employed with success for many years, whether it be 3C or Pool!

And are instructed and suggested By Jimmy Reid on His website and DVD's! http://www.freepoollessons.com/

Last edited by mr3cushion; 04-25-2015 at 11:10 AM.
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  #26  
Old 04-25-2015, 11:12 AM
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SJDinPHX SJDinPHX is offline
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Originally Posted by LSJohn View Post
I know you're half (or more ) joking, but maybe the SYSTEM can offer preciseness to put you under the 1 (I doubt it) but it looks to me that if you hit anywhere between 1/4 and 1/2 of the four with 9 o'clock -- any stroke -- and the right speed, you can't avoid ending behind the 1-13.
I agree with all the 'J's (both John's and Jeff) !..I think my first choice, would be banking the 9, and following down behind the 1/13..Just looks a little easier, than going 3 rails off the 4, but either one should work !
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  #27  
Old 04-25-2015, 11:31 AM
crabbcatjohn crabbcatjohn is offline
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Originally Posted by One Pocket Ghost View Post
Billy....Huh? - I'm surprised to see you say this...every One Pocket player that can play pretty good or better, that I know, will shoot this shot.

- Ghost
One of the first escape shots i was shown.
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  #28  
Old 04-25-2015, 01:03 PM
lll lll is online now
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Originally Posted by mr3cushion View Post


John; You are mostly correct, whether jokingly or not! My intention was to show a viable 'correct system' and 'technique' for these types of escapes when the OB is frozen to the first cushion!

Jimmy Reid who has been a long time friend and was hanging around Chicago in the late 60's early 70's at Bensingers. Jimmy was always fascinated with 3C, and loved to bang them around with me and talk about different systems and techniques for CB control to incorporate into Pool!

He's the one that first setup the layout in my diagram, using the info I provided Him on occasions playing 3C!

Don't get me wrong, there are 'other' options, this was just one of them that appeals to me for many reasons. And with a little practice and the 'correct' info other's may too!

Many Billiard and Pool players when approaching to play THIS type of shot that use a 'Diamond' system use the WRONG one! They instinctively go right to the, '5 Corner' system, this would be fine if, 'the CB was 4 or 5 inches from the first cushion! But, the CB is 'frozen' in this example, without manufacturing a angle the CB can ONLY contact the cushion a inch or two on the rail from where it already lies! Plus, we're really Only interested in a 'natural angle' from the 2nd and 3rd rails to the 4th! hence forth, the 'Plus 2' system is FAR more accurate for calculating this type of shot mathematically!

About the technique needed for the BEST results. If a player uses a 'normal' follow-thru, with the CB frozen to the rail, it will cause a 'wide angle' carom! The CB will contact the 2nd rail somewhat closer to the center diamond on the short cushion, which would most likely scratch or hit the 9 ball! By using a 'short or jab' stoke (less the length of the bridge) we can make a clean hit on the OB and create the angle without speed or draw on the CB! This is a 'standard' technique when trying to create a shorter than normal angle going 3, 4 or 5 cushions when the OB is frozen or nearly frozen to the first rail!
the cue ball is NOT frozen the object ball is
using the corner 5
if you use a tangent line from contact on the 4 ball it looks to me the cue ball is coming from seventy into 50 1rst rail to 20 3rd rail with normal running not 9 o'clock
the 20 track on a pool table gets you to the 1st diamond above the corner pocket (as a general guideline)
so why wouldnt that system work??
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  #29  
Old 04-25-2015, 01:08 PM
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wgcp wgcp is offline
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good question... I would shoot it like you diagramed...

B
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  #30  
Old 04-25-2015, 02:48 PM
Jeff sparks Jeff sparks is offline
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Originally Posted by mr3cushion View Post
I certainly hope so Billy, I'm just trying to help players that want to learn some proven methods that I've employed with success for many years, whether it be 3C or Pool!

And are instructed and suggested By Jimmy Reid on His website and DVD's! http://www.freepoollessons.com/
I wish I had run into you back then, (the late 60's), I think we would have gotten along very well. I was really interested in learning 3 cushion billiards back then because I knew it would be invaluable information that most of the better than average players didn't completely possess. Problem was, the people I knew and associated with back then weren't into giving up any information which might lend itself to their defeat. I don't really blame them, I understand that most of them learned the hard way. I do believe that if our paths had somehow crossed, learning from you would have advanced my skill level and overall effectiveness by leaps and bounds. I have been enjoying the learning experience even now, although I'm afraid the newfound knowledge will never be applied by this old road tick.
Is Jimmie Reid still kickin? I'd like to say hello, we played each other a number of times and it was always a great match, he had tremendous heart and breaking him down was next to impossible! Great player!
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