wwyd

Tom Wirth

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In this situation your opponent pocket scratched when needing two balls. You had three. With a draw stroke, you have just pocketed the spot shot and now the three ball is primed. You now have four. The question is; do you play for the eight and five now or do you bank the one first?

Tom
 

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One Pocket Ghost

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In this situation your opponent pocket scratched when needing two balls. You had three. With a draw stroke, you have just pocketed the spot shot and now the three ball is primed. You now have four. The question is; do you play for the eight and five now or do you bank the one first?

Tom
Imo, there's no question that you play for the 8 and 5 balls first...because...

#1. You have a perfect angle on the 3ball cut shot to get there...

#2. There's a higher % of making the straight in shot on the 8 or 5 than there is in shooting the cross corner bank...

#3. You have a larger area of position to land in, with there being two balls there to choose between, depending on exactly where you end up...

#4. In continuing your run, it's easier to get from the 8 and 5 to the 1, rather than vice-versa - you'd have to get pinpoint perfect on the bank in order to drag whitey up the rail for the 5 and 8.

- Ghost
 
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wincardona

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Imo, there's no question that you play for the 8 and 5 balls first...because...

#1. You have a perfect angle on the 3ball cut shot to get there...

#2. There's a higher % of making the straight in shot on the 8 or 5 than there is in shooting the cross corner bank...

#3. You have a larger area of position to land in, with there being two balls there to choose between, depending on exactly where you end up...

#4. In continuing your run, it's easier to get from the 8 and 5 to the 1, rather than vice-versa.

- Ghost
Very well explained, I like 3,5,8, for the reason that you will fall short less often then if you played 3,8, whatever. You want to shoot the 3ball with enough speed to at least fall on the 8ball, falling short you will not have a shot, but if you fall short playing for the 5ball you will have a good shot on the 8ball and possibly still end up with an angle to either draw for the 5ball or play for the bank on the 1ball. Very much like the adage used when putting playing golf..make sure you reach the hole, any put hit too soft will never go in.

Dr. Bill
 
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Cory in dc

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Imo, there's no question that you play for the 8 and 5 balls first...because...

#1. You have a perfect angle on the 3ball cut shot to get there...

#2. There's a higher % of making the straight in shot on the 8 or 5 than there is in shooting the cross corner bank...

#3. You have a larger area of position to land in, with there being two balls there to choose between, depending on exactly where you end up...

#4. In continuing your run, it's easier to get from the 8 and 5 to the 1, rather than vice-versa - you'd have to get pinpoint perfect on the bank in order to drag whitey up the rail for the 5 and 8.

- Ghost
Those were my exact thoughts, too. On the other hand, it's not uncommon for me to get position on the 5 or 8 but not so that it's easy to get both balls.

The total return comparison is perhaps closer than all your points suggest. By that, I mean that the 3 is laying where it's also pretty damn easy to get exactly where you want be on the 1: an easy bank where you can stun the cueball up for the 8 and 5. Worst case is probably the 1 hanging with the 5 and 8 protecting. Best case is 4 and out.

If I'm banking well, I might go with the bank early. But most of the time, I'd go for the 5/8 for the simple reason that, with two balls uptable, getting three balls is good enough even if I dog the 1 ball bank at the end.

Cory
 

mr3cushion

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I've been playing 3C on a 5x10 GC pool table now for about 3 months. IMHO, trying to get the, 'Correct angle' on the 5 & 8 are going to be extremely difficult!

#1. You have to get pass the side pocket for your 2nd rail, if you don't, you may scratch.

#2. Even going pass the side pocket, now the angle is wrong coming off the 3rd rail to get to the 4th.

#3. The target area your trying to get to on the 4th cushion, and stay there is really small. You have to land on the rail in order to play position for the 8!

#4. If you do even get the angle to start to head towards the 5 & 8, you may scratch in the other side pocket.

I were to even try to play for the 5 & 8, it would be ONE cushion to the left, trying to get behind the 8 NOT the 5.

All in all, I would play for the bank, if I make it, (and try and leave the CB on the side cushion) then roll up on the out side ball up in the corner, or even make it and leave him on that other ball. If you don't make the 1 ball now He's close to the rail trying to get the ball out!
 
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darmoose

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I've been playing 3C on a 5x10 GC pool table now for about 3 months. IMHO, trying to get the, 'Correct angle' on the 5 & 8 are going to be extremely difficult!

#1. You have to get pass the side pocket for your 2nd rail, if you don't, you may scratch.

#2. Even going pass the side pocket, now the angle is wrong coming off the 3rd rail to get to the 4th.

#3. The target area your trying to get to on the 4th cushion, and stay there is really small. You have to land on the rail in order to play position for the 8!

#4. If you do even get the angle to start to head towards the 5 & 8, you may scratch in the other side pocket.

I were to even try to play for the 5 & 8, it would be ONE cushion to the left, trying to get behind the 8 NOT the 5.

All in all, I would play for the bank, if I make it, (and try and leave the CB on the side cushion) then roll up on the out side ball up in the corner, or even make it and leave him on that other ball. If you don't make the 1 ball now He's close to the rail trying to get the ball out!
All one pocket players who would go for the five or the eight ball, and were planning to go four rails around the table to get there, raise your hand!:lol:lol
 

bstroud

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I also think you should play for position on the 5 ball.

No one has mentioned shooting the 3 ball with high left and going 3 rails for position. This will get you below the 5 ball where you want to be.

Bill S.
 

Mkbtank

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wwyd

Ghost I understand your logic and they were my first thoughts. But then I looked at the table and thought... "What would I really probably do?"

It may be unpopular here on the PC where none of us miss position (😁) but in reality I think I would play for the 1.

I have two concerns getting on the 5 and 8. 1. The scratch in the side and 2. If overcooked, I'm now hidden from the 1 and need to thin the 5 to get under the one, possibly leaving a return shot.

I guess it also depends on who I'm playing and if I can out move them. If I'm s better move, that makes me more likely to shoot the 1. If they are a better mover, then I'd better take advantage of my opportunity, even if I think it's riskier, to get more balls.

I don't like this one Bc I know am being a sissy lol, but I think that's what I would do.
 

Island Drive

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8/5 position zone is huge and the cut angle allows a high 3 o'clock stun shot that's easy to control.
 

LSJohn

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Ghost I understand your logic and they were my first thoughts. But then I looked at the table and thought... "What would I really probably do?"

It may be unpopular here on the PC where none of us miss position (😁) but in reality I think I would play for the 1.

I have two concerns getting on the 5 and 8. 1. The scratch in the side and 2. If overcooked, I'm now hidden from the 1 and need to thin the 5 to get under the one, possibly leaving a return shot.

I guess it also depends on who I'm playing and if I can out move them. If I'm s better move, that makes me more likely to shoot the 1. If they are a better mover, then I'd better take advantage of my opportunity, even if I think it's riskier, to get more balls.

I don't like this one Bc I know am being a sissy lol, but I think that's what I would do.
Well, this is a real dilemma for me because I don't like to disagree with Dr. Bill or Ghost (and It's more fun to pull your chain) but I'm with you on this one.

Part of the reason is that I tend to shoot cross-corner banks with more accuracy and CB control crossing them than I do shooting them on-angle, and getting the crossing angle I want for crossing the 1 looks pretty good off the 3. After banking the 1 with only decent speed and accuracy my CB is rolling up the rail and something good is going to happen almost every time.

I don't know what's right, but I know what I would do.
 

Mkbtank

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wwyd

You know what, I think I'm changing my shot. Bill's comment made me look again and that landing zone really is big. I'm playing for the five. :)
 

LSJohn

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You know what, I think I'm changing my shot. Bill's comment made me look again and that landing zone really is big. I'm playing for the five. :)
:eek: Now I'm disagreein' with ALL my heroes. :lol
 

androd

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Well, this is a real dilemma for me because I don't like to disagree with Dr. Bill or Ghost (and It's more fun to pull your chain) but I'm with you on this one.

Part of the reason is that I tend to shoot cross-corner banks with more accuracy and CB control crossing them than I do shooting them on-angle, and getting the crossing angle I want for crossing the 1 looks pretty good off the 3. After banking the 1 with only decent speed and accuracy my CB is rolling up the rail and something good is going to happen almost every time.

I don't know what's right, but I know what I would do.
I also like crossing the 1ball and trying for shape. If the CB is hit to hard your opponent has a choice, move the 1ball or shoot a fairly tough combo.
Rod.
 

mr3cushion

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You know what, I think I'm changing my shot. Bill's comment made me look again and that landing zone really is big. I'm playing for the five. :)
Mitch; when you get to the billiard room, chk and see how 'BIG' that landing zone is to get perfect on the 8 to have a shot on the 5!

IMHO, I think it will shrink quite a bit at the table!
;)
 

pvclou

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wwyd

This was my thinking too. Frankly, I'm surprised at the replies by Billy I. and the Ghost (who is a "mover").

Ghost I understand your logic and they were my first thoughts. But then I looked at the table and thought... "What would I really probably do?"

It may be unpopular here on the PC where none of us miss position (😁) but in reality I think I would play for the 1.

I have two concerns getting on the 5 and 8. 1. The scratch in the side and 2. If overcooked, I'm now hidden from the 1 and need to thin the 5 to get under the one, possibly leaving a return shot.

I guess it also depends on who I'm playing and if I can out move them. If I'm s better move, that makes me more likely to shoot the 1. If they are a better mover, then I'd better take advantage of my opportunity, even if I think it's riskier, to get more balls.

I don't like this one Bc I know am being a sissy lol, but I think that's what I would do.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

gulfportdoc

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I took the layout to the table. The camera angle on this photo makes the cue ball look further up table than it actually is. Unless I'm reading it wrong, the CB is only about 1/2 diamond above the foot rail.

If that's true, then it's difficult to try to three or four-rail the CB off the 3 ball, because there's not enough cut angle. However it is easy to simply two-rail the CB using straight left spin. That allows for position on the 5 ball.

It's also easy to drag the CB up one-rail with low right. Depending on the angle used, the shooter can play position for the 8 or the 5. That choice also allows more of a chance to knock away the 1 ball if the position shot comes short.

This is one of those layouts where there's a lot to consider. I agree with Ghost's points. The shooter might also reason that shooting the 1 ball first, while making the position trickier for the 8 or 5, does result in taking away the trouble ball. Plus getting position for the perfect angle on the 1 ball to allow for the best position opportunity for the 8 or 5 requires fairly pinpoint accuracy.

Still, I have a better feel for two rails out of the corner off the 3 ball, so that's probably what I'd shoot. However if the CB is more like a full diamond up from the foot rail, I'd probably shoot the one-rail shape shot.

~Doc
 

One Pocket Ghost

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This was my thinking too. Frankly, I'm surprised at the replies by Billy I. and the Ghost (who is a "mover").

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I stop moving when I'm running balls...:)

- Ghost

PS, And I used to play straight pool back in the 70's...:heh
 

Tom Wirth

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Well now, We have two camps again. Dr. Bill and the Ghost like playing directly for the five and eight balls while others like LSJohn and sometimes Mitch who seems to be waffling a bit, prefer playing for the bank on the one.

Is there one "right" way to play this regardless of your skill level? I think not. Is there a way to improve on your percentages for winning this game by playing the shot one way verses the other? I think so.

Players with excellent cue ball control may believe their best chance is to play for the eight and five. With one exception, Ghost made good points promoting this choice.

The one point where I disagree has to do with his approach to the bank on the one. He did not take into consideration the cross over angle which allows for the cue ball to take a natural path straight up the side rail which leads directly to position on the eight and five.

Is this cross over bank more difficult than the flat full hit bank? I don't believe so. But that's me. I like these banks. These cross over banks are in my opinion the bread and butter of One Pocket. With easy, calculable speed control, the cue ball can be played up table on your opponent's side where many more opportunities to score are most likely available.

Does all this mean I would play for the bank instead of the eight and five? I think that might depend on how confident in my speed control at this moment. If I haven't become accustomed to this table I would definitely play for the bank. I have much greater latitude with the speed when playing for this cross bank. And with that natural path for the cue ball my position is far more predictable. All I have to worry about is making the bank. I like my odds here too.

So here is an image of the cross bank and cookies to all of you because in a case like this I think a lot of the decision is like your choice in women. There's someone for everyone. :)

Tom
 

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mr3cushion

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Well now, We have two camps again. Dr. Bill and the Ghost like playing directly for the five and eight balls while others like LSJohn and sometimes Mitch who seems to be waffling a bit, prefer playing for the bank on the one.

Is there one "right" way to play this regardless of your skill level? I think not. Is there a way to improve on your percentages for winning this game by playing the shot one way verses the other? I think so.

Players with excellent cue ball control may believe their best chance is to play for the eight and five. With one exception, Ghost made good points promoting this choice.

The one point where I disagree has to do with his approach to the bank on the one. He did not take into consideration the cross over angle which allows for the cue ball to take a natural path straight up the side rail which leads directly to position on the eight and five.

Is this cross over bank more difficult than the flat full hit bank? I don't believe so. But that's me. I like these banks. These cross over banks are in my opinion the bread and butter of One Pocket. With easy, calculable speed control, the cue ball can be played up table on your opponent's side where many more opportunities to score are most likely available.

Does all this mean I would play for the bank instead of the eight and five? I think that might depend on how confident in my speed control at this moment. If I haven't become accustomed to this table I would definitely play for the bank. I have much greater latitude with the speed when playing for this cross bank. And with that natural path for the cue ball my position is far more predictable. All I have to worry about is making the bank. I like my odds here too.

So here is an image of the cross bank and cookies to all of you because in a case like this I think a lot of the decision is like your choice in women. There's someone for everyone. :)

Tom
Tom; Why do YOU think going 4 cushions is the wrong choice here?

I gave my reasons and opinions, just curious what yours are!
 

keoneyo

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For me, I take this into consideration. If I get shape on the 5 after pocketing the pink ball can I win the game? Yes, there is that potential. (Making the 8 and banking the 1 in succession).

If I go for the bank on the 1, where do I stand? You are now equal in ball count and still uncertain as to the results . We would be 6/5, at best, with me playing safe off of 2 balls on my opponents side. That is if I make the bank.

(Those 2 balls near the hole are crucial. Because it provides my opponent with a great safe opportunity by bringing down a ball and leaving me jacked up on the other. This is if I take the bank option, make it, and play safe off the 2 balls on my opponents side.)

If I miss the bank and leave a cross corner for my opponent can he win the game. Yes there is that potential with 2 balls on his side of the table.


All in all if Im playing a tough or equal opponent I would try to win the game. The reward outweighs the risk.
If Im playing fish I go for the bank. This is me.
 
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