WWYD-in this tough spot.

mr3cushion

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Just to be clear, I am not kicking, I am shooting the CB into the 14 but not straight through it, I am aiming to the left more...does that still constitute a foul? Just curious, thanks!
Not quite sure, with all the rule changes these days.

Dr. Bill would know more about that better than me.

I know in 3C, you can never play off a frozen ball at any angle.
 

cincy_kid

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Not quite sure, with all the rule changes these days.

Dr. Bill would know more about that better than me.

I know in 3C, you can never play off a frozen ball at any angle.
I did not know that, thanks Bill!
 

beatle

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in a general gambling game, which is what i talk about not a tournament where a ref is there to watch.

a controversial shot is considered okay if your opponent doesnt say anything before you shoot. then you have a discussion and decide. same as if a ball is frozen to a rail or not. if opponent doesnt say something before you shoot then it isnt.
same on two scratches, or when the cueball is close and a double hit is possible and you jack up to 45 degrees.
 

mr3cushion

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I did not know that, thanks Bill!
No problem.
in a general gambling game, which is what i talk about not a tournament where a ref is there to watch.

a controversial shot is considered okay if your opponent doesnt say anything before you shoot. then you have a discussion and decide. same as if a ball is frozen to a rail or not. if opponent doesnt say something before you shoot then it isnt.
same on two scratches, or when the cueball is close and a double hit is possible and you jack up to 45 degrees.
I other words, if you don't get caught beforehand! :sneaky:
 

beatle

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of course bill, a person cant sit in their chair and watch what likely or could will be an illegal shot and wait until its over then complain. he needs to point it out before hand. thats just my opinion.
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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For those that want to review my thread; when two balls are frozen to the cb. Go to search, main forum, author Dennis "Whitey" Young, title Two Balls Frozen to the Cue Ball.
There are several videos, plus the 3 ball Whitey shot is in there also, for those that have not seen it.
But it will explain this in much detail.

Thanks Dr. Bill for recognizing this shot as a foul, it is greatly appreciated. Whitey
 

beatle

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so is touching an object ball at any time. some rules that are different for different games or places need to be clarified before hand.
so pushing through one ball is okay but not two.
 

mr3cushion

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As I'm going thru AZ & 1P folders, it seems I've posted this situation some years prior. If any of you keep records, and I'm pretty sure some do, my choice had already been posted back then.

But for newbies or non logistical's, here it is.

I in deed played the, 'draw angled' kick into the 15 ball, with enough speed to come out to the middle of the table.

In this position, the player doesn't have much of a choice to aim at the long cushion, (because of the position of balls around the CB).

The method of aiming here is to, 'aim at a 45 degree angle into the rail,' as diagrammed.

Here it is.

WWYD1001-result.jpg
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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so is touching an object ball at any time. some rules that are different for different games or places need to be clarified before hand.
so pushing through one ball is okay but not two.
Beatle, I'd like to reply to; "pushing through one ball is okay but not two". I believe this is a long forgotten rule, but in all the hundreds of books, plus articles, rule books, anything you can imagine, going back a 100 yrs. why is there not one illustration of shooting a throw shot that involves the cue ball frozen to more than one object ball. Always a throw shot illustration is either the cb traveling to balls frozen, or the cb being frozed to one ball.

In my thread on this shot, I do a throw shot involving two balls frozen to the cb in line. I stroke it on a 45 degree angle and make the middle ball. I discovered this shot when I was working on the foul criteria for this shot. So did I discover something new or was it something that just was never illustrated for it was known as a foul.

I believe I learned of this from Curly Brighman who was in his mid 60's in '68. He owned Brighman Billiards where I first stated playing. He showed me a trick shot where he had two ball frozen to the cue ball on the long rail, and you either make the center or the two outside balls, but he said the shot was illegal. Whitey
 

ppanzera

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If beatles 4ball combo is not dead-on.....then instead, you shoot into your opponent's long rail approx. 1/3rd of a diamond up from his corner pocket with low right english...the cueball comes off of the long rail and curves around the 10 and 13 to make the 15, than continues on to shape up the 3ball, 11ball, 2ball or 4ball.....all 3cushion players, and also experienced One Pocket players would see this shot.

- Ghost
This is the right answer. Some 3-cushion cross-table shots require this technique. You need more draw than right, as the draw is what bends the ball. You also want softer than you think, or you'll lose the bend. You also want a steeper angle into the rail than you might think, perhaps up to 40-45 degrees. You can bend the ball easily enough to make the 15 without even hitting the short rail. It's well worth practicing, and you can get the feel of it pretty quickly. It's a short, crisp, soft stroke.
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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mr3c, That is one hell of a shot! As it appears that is quite an angle to overcome, arch, bend. Very specatular, the next game the guy is going to ask for a couple more balls.
I'll probably put up a video of jumping off the long and over those balls, if OneRock does not beat me to it.
mr3c has also put up some of these banana shots on the bank forum that you guys should check out. They are excellent instructional videos of how to do the shot.
thanks for the wwyd. Whitey
 

mr3cushion

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This is a, 'mini' version of the, 'draw angle kick.

When I shot it some years ago, I wasn't in a position to run more balls, just to kick at the ball in the pocket.

 
Last edited:

Billy Jackets

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If you try to kick to the long rail, the CB is only 1 ball width away from the cushion, also the center lines of the 14/8/13 looks like it will hit too much of the 13.

Anyway, like in my other WWYD, there is no wrong shot, "What you think you can execute!"
i like this thought. I have always thought that I would rather play an inferior shot perfectly, and win , than the perfect shot poorly, and lose. It all boils down to ,as you said , what can you execute, and if you are not in touch with the reality of your game, you will be one of the broke pool players , instead of one with a chip and a chair!
 

12squared

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This is a, 'mini' version of the, 'draw angle kick.

When I shot it some years ago, I wasn't in a position to run more balls, just to kick at the ball in the pocket.

Great execution and creative, but the result in your clip seems to have removed your advatage. Yes?
 

lll

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thanks bill for an educational wwyd
thanks for explaining and showing how to hit it too
 
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