WWYD - Chicago Fats vs Random Ray at Chris' Billiards

ChicagoFats

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Ok. So I walk in and there isn't much one hole action. I am watching a couple of younger players battling on table 1.
On table 2 there are two older guys playing cheap and one wants to quit but is in the middle of the set. Anyhow they finish the set and Random Ray(nice older gentlemen I never seen hit a ball) still wants to play. I told I will play him. He says he can't play even so I ask the Mexican Paul the owner what I need to give him. He says I don't know, but I give him 12 - 6. So I say ok Ray... you got 12 - 6. He says rackem up. I have never given that big of a spot to anyone in my life. This was a guy I knew I was better than but who knows by how much.

Anyhow, we are now playing a race to 3 which will result in me being stuck 100 if I lose. So it was fun to me.
We are hill hill.... you are shooting to the top left pocket in the first picture. He has a ball almost hanging in his pocket.
The ball count is 5 - 3 in your favor. If you leave him a shot he probably runs 3 85% of the time.







 

cincy_kid

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I see 2 possible shots I like

1) Cut the 9 in and Cb to end rail and kick the 14 out (unless its too close and may scratch)

2) Shoot the 8 2 rails into some of the balls on his side, follow the CB down to the bottom rail keeping him off cutting the 14.
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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This reminds me of a match between Little Al and Efren, Al would continually leave Efren a lone shot at his hole, very similar to the 8-ball, but Efren never went for the bait! Whitey
 

Tobermory

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I'd be going all out to make the 14 off the 9 ball. I'd hit the carom hard enough that if I miss the 9 it won't be left for an easy bank. I feel pretty confident that I could 2 rail the 8 and roll the CB near enough to the short rail to deny a shot on the 14, but I'd hate to get that shot wrong, as it would lead to a quick loss.
 
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sappo

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I would hit the 9 ball straight on with the speed that's necessary to lay the cueball on the bottom rail. I believe i will have a better shot to possibly clear that ball by his pocket in the next couple of innings or have a better offensive opportunity. Keith
 

Mkbtank

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WWYD - Chicago Fats vs Random Ray at Chris' Billiards

I’d be cutting the 9 in even though it’s risky. Bad spot likely won’t get better so I’m taking action. I know you cut the 9 Fatty.
 

gulfportdoc

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There are two ways to consider shooting the 9. A good ball pocketer would aim to make the 9 with enough right spin on the CB to take out the 14-- perhaps even knock it over to the shooter's side. OTOH missing the 9 and clipping the 14 too thin could turn out badly.

The other way is to cinch the 14 takeout with the CB, and pay more attention to the 14 contact.

A guy could also kick off the long rail to roll up behind the 14.

But my sense is that if a guy is giving another guy 12-6 (in this layout he needs them all, whereas the opponent only needs 3), the guy is probably a good enough shooter to pocket the 9, or even the 8 ball...;)

~Doc
 

beatle

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if you are giving 12 to 6 to a guy that can run 3 85% of the time you need to be good enough to make the 8 and run 3 more 85% of the time.

shouldnt there be more balls on the table.
 

ChicagoFats

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if you are giving 12 to 6 to a guy that can run 3 85% of the time you need to be good enough to make the 8 and run 3 more 85% of the time.

shouldnt there be more balls on the table.
At 12 6.... I owe two at the beginning and go to 10.

Also... I didnt say he can run 3 85% of the time every game. I said he would run three this game with the balls playing the way they are 85% of the time.
 

ChicagoFats

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I would hit the 9 ball straight on with the speed that's necessary to lay the cueball on the bottom rail. I believe i will have a better shot to possibly clear that ball by his pocket in the next couple of innings or have a better offensive opportunity. Keith
I like this shot choice even though I didnt choose it.
 

ChicagoFats

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I'd be going all out to make the 14 off the 9 ball. I'd hit the carom hard enough that if I miss the 9 it won't be left for an easy bank. I feel pretty confident that I could 2 rail the 8 and roll the CB near enough to the short rail to deny a shot on the 14, but I'd hate to get that shot wrong, as it would lead to a quick loss.
I didnt even consider caroming his ball in. It wasn't hanging but you opened my eyes up to this shot... smart thinking.
 
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NH Steve

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if you are giving 12 to 6 to a guy that can run 3 85% of the time you need to be good enough to make the 8 and run 3 more 85% of the time.

shouldnt there be more balls on the table.
I was wondering about this too. I am assuming with a 12-6 game, that is a long count, so Fats would have spotted his first two balls, effectively playing 10-6 from there on out, correct? So if he did that and factored that in, then the score Fats said, 5-3 his favor, leaves him needing 5 and Ray needing 3 which does add up right looking at the seven balls left on the table. That is not a bad score situation for Fats, but obviously the table situation favors Ray a lot.

Given that, I might kick softly to the bottom rail over near the 14, aiming between the 8 and the side pocket basically. It looks too dangerous to me to try to kick out the 14 from there, but I'd like to lol.
 

ChicagoFats

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I was wondering about this too. I am assuming with a 12-6 game, that is a long count, so Fats would have spotted his first two balls, effectively playing 10-6 from there on out, correct? So if he did that and factored that in, then the score Fats said, 5-3 his favor, leaves him needing 5 and Ray needing 3 which does add up right looking at the seven balls left on the table. That is not a bad score situation for Fats, but obviously the table situation favors Ray a lot.

Given that, I might kick softly to the bottom rail over near the 14, aiming between the 8 and the side pocket basically. It looks too dangerous to me to try to kick out the 14 from there, but I'd like to lol.

You guys are really coming up with some good options. I normally shoot really fast regardless of safe or offense, but I obviously took some time here even to capture pictures.
 

Island Drive

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You guys are really coming up with some good options. I normally shoot really fast regardless of safe or offense, but I obviously took some time here even to capture pictures.
It's always nice tah see ones perspective compared to others.

My choice would be determined First by what I could or could Not do, safely with the 8 using inside spin. If I could shoot the 8 and, come long rail/short rail & drop to about the middle of the foot rail, then that's a go. And if I missed the 8 , my ball speed would not leave it near my pocket for a return bank. If I can get whitey correctly to the foot rail and pocket that 8, I will bank that ball by his hole into my pocket.
 

ChicagoFats

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Anyone brazen enough to cut the 6 in and z the cue ball down to end rail? Or is that too touchy?
 

beatle

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yea i was writing 12 to 6 and thinking 14 to 6, so the ball count is right. my blip.

still giving someone that spot i dont think its the right spot if he can run 3 from that spot 85% of the time, and looking at the ball positions he seems to move well. thats just a comment.
 

ChicagoFats

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yea i was writing 12 to 6 and thinking 14 to 6, so the ball count is right. my blip.

still giving someone that spot i dont think its the right spot if he can run 3 from that spot 85% of the time, and looking at the ball positions he seems to move well. thats just a comment.
I never get in good games, but it was fun.
 

catkins

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it seems you can cut the 6 and keep him doubled or trippled up well enough so I don't dis like that at all
 

vapros

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Come on, Fats. I used to know a girl who behaved like this - I finally had to stop calling her. :D
 

wincardona

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I would hit the 9 ball straight on with the speed that's necessary to lay the cueball on the bottom rail. I believe i will have a better shot to possibly clear that ball by his pocket in the next couple of innings or have a better offensive opportunity. Keith
This would be my choice as well. No need to gamble from this position, especially considering how the ball are positioned. Floating down to the bottom rail and positioning the 9ball on your side will offer you the best chance of getting away from this threatening situation. IMO

Dr. Bill
 
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