Wwyd-105

mr3cushion

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Well, since the Ghost started a 'Defensive' style thread, I thought I would follow suit!

You need one, your pocket is the lower left, WWYD to stymie your opponent?

View attachment 12133
 
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sappo

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I don't see this position as one that needs a defensive shot. Just cross the 5 ball using left spin and enough speed to bring the cb back up table. if you make a ball you win if you don't make a ball you now have 2 balls by your pocket with the cb back up table, this shot either wins the game or improves your position. Keith
 

gulfportdoc

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I'm coming off the right side of the 3 ball, rolling the CB up onto the opponent's side rail, trying to keep the cluster between the CB and the 3 ball.

Somebody's going to suggest playing an Okie Doke shot on the 8 ball-- I just know it.....:D

~Doc
 

Mkbtank

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Wwyd-105

Simple... Come off the right side of the 9, banking the 5 towards the 3 while double-banking the 8. 😎😳.
 

One pocket Smitty

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My shot was going to be the one described by Doc or back cutting the 5 and let the CB go 3 rails back up table.---Smitty
 
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straightback

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With few wonderful defensive opportunities (Doc's is the only really viable one I see), I might size up the 3-railer, paying more attention to locking him behind the spot balls than making the bank.
 

Jeff sparks

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I don't see this position as one that needs a defensive shot. Just cross the 5 ball using left spin and enough speed to bring the cb back up table. if you make a ball you win if you don't make a ball you now have 2 balls by your pocket with the cb back up table, this shot either wins the game or improves your position. Keith

This shot is the easiest for me to execute, I don't see any down side to it. In this inning I'm not disturbing the spotted balls, and now my op has to deal with two balls instead of just one. Trying to double your op behind the cluster seems an unnecessary risk at this point in the game, the snooker window is small and a pretty darn good hit with perfect speed is required, not my cup of tea.
Just my WWYD, or rather Sappo's. No offense Doc.
 

mr3cushion

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What happened to all the advocates of, 'KISS!' :frus

You need ONLY 1 ball, 2 balls are frozen on the spot, you have a ball on your side already! If you won't defend your lead here totally, when will you?

Doc's shot is the shot 'I' prefer here! It's NOT difficult to execute, you're mastery of a stroke is not need, and most importantly you 'double up' for the 3 ball with a wall of balls for your opponent to overcome!

View attachment 12134

Remember again, "You don't have to always shoot out, just give your opponent every opportunity to lose the game!"

Especially needing only 1 ball to win!
 
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wincardona

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This shot is the easiest for me to execute, I don't see any down side to it. In this inning I'm not disturbing the spotted balls, and now my op has to deal with two balls instead of just one. Trying to double your op behind the cluster seems an unnecessary risk at this point in the game, the snooker window is small and a pretty darn good hit with perfect speed is required, not my cup of tea.
Just my WWYD, or rather Sappo's. No offense Doc.
Doc's got tough skin don't worry he can handle it. But in defense of Doc I would like to add that the only reason Doc suggested this option was because he was trying to come up with a defensive move, as opposed to an offensive move, I think.:D

Dr. Bill
 

Jeff sparks

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Doc's got tough skin don't worry he can handle it. But in defense of Doc I would like to add that the only reason Doc suggested this option was because he was trying to come up with a defensive move, as opposed to an offensive move, I think.:D

Dr. Bill
That's all well and good Bill and I'm sure Doc was doing exactly that, replying in a defensive sense to the posed WWYD, but I'm a huge proponent of winning the game when offered an opportunity to do so, and as Sappo's has said previously, this is not a defensive shot posture situation in his opinion or mine. In reality and for the money, WWYD?
 

gulfportdoc

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That's all well and good Bill and I'm sure Doc was doing exactly that, replying in a defensive sense to the posed WWYD, but I'm a huge proponent of winning the game when offered an opportunity to do so, and as Sappo's has said previously, this is not a defensive shot posture situation in his opinion or mine. In reality and for the money, WWYD?
If the gap is large enough to allow a hit on about 1/4 of the 5 ball, yours may be a better shot. The object would be to have the 5 ball contact the rail approx. 1-1/2 diamond above the opponent's corner pocket.

I don't think a guy could get enough left spin on the CB to take it more than to the center of the head rail, especially from that distance; so unless either the 3 or 5 pockets, there's no problem for a return by the opponent.

The beauty of Bill S.'s shot is that the opponent is left with zilch.;)

~Doc
 

sappo

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If the gap is large enough to allow a hit on about 1/4 of the 5 ball, yours may be a better shot. The object would be to have the 5 ball contact the rail approx. 1-1/2 diamond above the opponent's corner pocket.

I don't think a guy could get enough left spin on the CB to take it more than to the center of the head rail, especially from that distance; so unless either the 3 or 5 pockets, there's no problem for a return by the opponent.

The beauty of Bill S.'s shot is that the opponent is left with zilch.;)

~Doc
Doc, I rarely defend the shoot I select but I'm going to here. Your safety as Jeff pointed our must be hit perfectly or it sells out a bank and that bank could cost you the game. banking the 5 ball, however, has plenty gap to allow a good hit for the direct bank or the combo bank to be made to win the game and as stated before if it misses your opponent then has to deal with 2 balls by your pocket with a cue ball up table. Actually if missed you may even have a ball hanging in your pocket.I just think its the better choice. Keith
 

gulfportdoc

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You might be right, Keith (see my post #13), although the speed management on the 3-ball shot is fairly easy.

~Doc
 

wincardona

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After careful scrutiny of the situation I believe that the shot the Doctor chose was correct. Keith's shot with banking the 5ball is clearly a viable option, however, there are a few concerns I have with his choice that I would like to discuss. First being the score, the shooter needs only one ball and all balls are in play. Also the balls that are in play are hard to move with two balls being positioned on the foot spot. Balls that are on the foot spot are hard to move which benefits the non shooter, and it's very important to reposition those balls if given an opportunity which you have with the 3ball option. With the 3ball option you can bank the 3ball to the side rail and position the cue ball on the other side of the spotted balls not leaving a shot on the 3ball for your opponent which would then force him to move the balls that are on the foot spot. From there your job of putting them on your side or out of play becomes much easier and certainly relieves a lot of pressure that you would have if the foot spotted balls were not moved. If the shooter needed two balls then that imo would put a much different perspective on the situation and make the 5ball bank a more appealing option.

Secondly, the distance of the 5ball bank option may create accuracy problems that could result in either a scratch or a return shot on the 5ball, which neither of those things are affordable considering the score and the 3ball option you have as an option.

I think the score of the game pretty much decides for me which option is the better option, i'm choosing the 3ball option in a situation where things can turn suddenly unless you choose a shot that would assist in curtailing the ugliness that could pursue.

Dr. Bill
 

mr3cushion

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After careful scrutiny of the situation I believe that the shot the Doctor chose was correct. Keith's shot with banking the 5ball is clearly a viable option, however, there are a few concerns I have with his choice that I would like to discuss. First being the score, the shooter needs only one ball and all balls are in play. Also the balls that are in play are hard to move with two balls being positioned on the foot spot. Balls that are on the foot spot are hard to move which benefits the non shooter, and it's very important to reposition those balls if given an opportunity which you have with the 3ball option. With the 3ball option you can bank the 3ball to the side rail and position the cue ball on the other side of the spotted balls not leaving a shot on the 3ball for your opponent which would then force him to move the balls that are on the foot spot. From there your job of putting them on your side or out of play becomes much easier and certainly relieves a lot of pressure that you would have if the foot spotted balls were not moved. If the shooter needed two balls then that imo would put a much different perspective on the situation and make the 5ball bank a more appealing option.

Secondly, the distance of the 5ball bank option may create accuracy problems that could result in either a scratch or a return shot on the 5ball, which neither of those things are affordable considering the score and the 3ball option you have as an option.

I think the score of the game pretty much decides for me which option is the better option, i'm choosing the 3ball option in a situation where things can turn suddenly unless you choose a shot that would assist in curtailing the ugliness that could pursue.

Dr. Bill
BINGO! Give that man a cigar for ALL the RIGHT reasons!

You are going to FORCE you opponent to make a HUGE mistake on the next shot, NO matter what he attempts!

Dr Bill preforms another painless operation!
 

sappo

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I hear what you're saying Dr Bill and if the shooter can hit your defensive shot without selling out a bank but can't hit the cross bank well enough to avoid selling out THEN your shot is clearly the shot he should shoot. keith
 

mr3cushion

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I hear what you're saying Dr Bill and if the shooter can hit your defensive shot without selling out a bank but can't hit the cross bank well enough to avoid selling out THEN your shot is clearly the shot he should shoot. keith
As in my diagram in post #10.
 

LSJohn

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What happened to all the advocates of, 'KISS!' :frus

You need ONLY 1 ball, 2 balls are frozen on the spot, you have a ball on your side already! If you won't defend your lead here totally, when will you?

Doc's shot is the shot 'I' prefer here! It's NOT difficult to execute, you're mastery of a stroke is not need, and most importantly you 'double up' for the 3 ball with a wall of balls for your opponent to overcome!

View attachment 12134

Remember again, "You don't have to always shoot out, just give your opponent every opportunity to lose the game!"

Especially needing only 1 ball to win!
How about shooting this to hit the 3 thinner to keep it lower and let the CB run higher?
 
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