Smartest Onepocket Player In Life

Houston_ron_1966

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Who do you think is the smartest onepocket player in the world and why do you think they are the smatest onepocket player in the world and do they have any contests or tournament to prove who is the smartest onepocket player in the world is.

Thanks,

Houston_ron
 

NH Steve

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Houston_ron_1966 said:
Who do you think is the smartest onepocket player in the world and why do you think they are the smatest onepocket player in the world and do they have any contests or tournament to prove who is the smartest onepocket player in the world is.

Thanks,

Houston_ron
A number of close observers and players have said that Artie Bodendorfer, formerly of Chicago, but now retired in Vegas, made the most of his abilities compared to other top players. He didn't shoot as well, didn't run balls as well, didn't bank as well, but he moved better than anybody, and played a couple of balls over his ability because he played so smart, and controlled the cue ball so well. I guess in regard to controlling the cue ball, he did execute well.
 

One Pocket Ghost

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Houston_ron_1966 said:
Who do you know to be the smartest onepocket player in the world.

Thanks,

Houston_ron


That would be me........................:eek:
 
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NH Steve

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It should be noted that Artie played a conservative style, that often wore out the more agressive style of player. But if you are talking the creative kind of smarts for One Pocket, I would add a definite nod to Ronnie Allen and Jack Breit for their inventiveness.
 

gulfportdoc

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Squeezers

Squeezers

Since the topic has taken a turn towards squeezers with the last two posts, you'd have to mention Jimmy Fusco, or even Nick Varner. I watched a tape of Jimmy Fusco and Rempe (with F. Bentivegna commentating), in which Fusco squeezed so hard, the table dried out! Even Freddie was saying, "Shoot at something!":D

Doc
 

onepocket

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If you watch Efren Reyes, it's a completely unique and different way of playing. I mean, when he is in gear, he comes up with some absolutely beautiful shots -- ultra thin cuts with crazy extreme english, masse shots, kicks, etc. -- many of which he gets near perfect position out of, which is mind-boggling considering the level of difficulty in execution (for mere mortals).

However, that said, he does not consistently use some of the most basic "playing the score" and table management techniques that most successful One Pocket players consider absolute laws of the game. In fact, this year at the Derby, Efren lost twice in One Pocket for the first time ever, and I watched both losses. I would unequivically say that his failure to adhere to those fundamental laws cost him both matches.

Against Alex, Efren needed only only one ball to put Alex away, and Alex needed eight. Efren did knock a chunk of the remaining stack up table to a degree, but he commited a cardinal sin by exposing a desperation shot for Alex, which Alex buried and ran out. If Efren had instead forced Alex to push balls up table (or do something crazy), by locking Alex under the remaining balls, Efren wins that game, barring something crazy happening.

Against Gabe, again, Efren needed one ball to win, and Gabe scratched, which left a line up of three balls onthe foot spot, and a couple more loose balls -- one on the foot rail about a diamond away from Gabe's pocket, one up by the side pocket on Gabe's side. Now everbody that plays those basic laws of One Pocket knocks away the ball on the foot rail and leaves Gabe down table, preferably snookered from the loose balls so all he can shoot at (without kicking) is the underside of the three balls lined up on the spot. Inexplicably, Efren shot at the three balls, opening them up and Gabe ran out from there.

That's not smart One Pocket!
 

fred bentivegna

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excellent line

excellent line

gulfportdoc said:
..... in which Fusco squeezed so hard, the table dried out! ......

Doc
Now, that's a good pool line, Doc.

the Beard
 

fred bentivegna

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Finally!

Finally!

onepocket said:
....However, that said, he does not consistently use some of the most basic "playing the score" and table management techniques that most successful One Pocket players consider absolute laws of the game. In fact, this year at the Derby, Efren lost twice in One Pocket for the first time ever, and I watched both losses. I would unequivically say that his failure to adhere to those fundamental laws cost him both matches.

Against Alex, Efren needed only only one ball to put Alex away, and Alex needed eight. Efren did knock a chunk of the remaining stack up table to a degree, but he commited a cardinal sin by exposing a desperation shot for Alex, which Alex buried and ran out. If Efren had instead forced Alex to push balls up table (or do something crazy), by locking Alex under the remaining balls, Efren wins that game, barring something crazy happening.

Against Gabe, again, Efren needed one ball to win, and Gabe scratched, which left a line up of three balls onthe foot spot, and a couple more loose balls -- one on the foot rail about a diamond away from Gabe's pocket, one up by the side pocket on Gabe's side. Now everbody that plays those basic laws of One Pocket knocks away the ball on the foot rail and leaves Gabe down table, preferably snookered from the loose balls so all he can shoot at (without kicking) is the underside of the three balls lined up on the spot. Inexplicably, Efren shot at the three balls, opening them up and Gabe ran out from there.

That's not smart One Pocket!
Finally somebody noticed what I've been harping about for years. MANAGEMENT TECHNIQUES! I have said for years that Efren and others don't "clean up" the balls when they are ahead. That style works fine when you have an enormous advantage in skill, but when you run into somebody with comparable skills you will suffer for it. The players probably think that it is unmanly to play that way.

the Beard

Buy my DVD for God's sake!
 

SJDinPHX

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onepocket said:
If you watch Efren Reyes, it's a completely unique and different way of playing. I mean, when he is in gear, he comes up with some absolutely beautiful shots -- ultra thin cuts with crazy extreme english, masse shots, kicks, etc. -- many of which he gets near perfect position out of, which is mind-boggling considering the level of difficulty in execution (for mere mortals).

However, that said, he does not consistently use some of the most basic "playing the score" and table management techniques that most successful One Pocket players consider absolute laws of the game. In fact, this year at the Derby, Efren lost twice in One Pocket for the first time ever, and I watched both losses. I would unequivically say that his failure to adhere to those fundamental laws cost him both matches.

Against Alex, Efren needed only only one ball to put Alex away, and Alex needed eight. Efren did knock a chunk of the remaining stack up table to a degree, but he commited a cardinal sin by exposing a desperation shot for Alex, which Alex buried and ran out. If Efren had instead forced Alex to push balls up table (or do something crazy), by locking Alex under the remaining balls, Efren wins that game, barring something crazy happening.

Against Gabe, again, Efren needed one ball to win, and Gabe scratched, which left a line up of three balls onthe foot spot, and a couple more loose balls -- one on the foot rail about a diamond away from Gabe's pocket, one up by the side pocket on Gabe's side. Now everbody that plays those basic laws of One Pocket knocks away the ball on the foot rail and leaves Gabe down table, preferably snookered from the loose balls so all he can shoot at (without kicking) is the underside of the three balls lined up on the spot. Inexplicably, Efren shot at the three balls, opening them up and Gabe ran out from there.

That's not smart One Pocket!
Ghost, You hit the nail on the head! There are certain intangibles in the game of 1P that must be adhered to. Efren, with all his skill as a player, did not
adhere to these givens. He knows where he erred. He may come back stronger than ever because of it.
 
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heart

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fred bentivegna said:
Finally somebody noticed what I've been harping about for years. MANAGEMENT TECHNIQUES! I have said for years that Efren and others don't "clean up" the balls when they are ahead. That style works fine when you have an enormous advantage in skill, but when you run into somebody with comparable skills you will suffer for it. The players probably think that it is unmanly to play that way.

the Beard

Buy my DVD for God's sake!
Well, Freddy, isn't it also possible that you just happened :D to neglect to explain that important aspect of One Pocket knowledge to Efren back in Efren's early One Pocket days in Chicago? We all know you have little subterfuge in your modus operandi...
 

philip guagliardo

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hi

hi

I naturally never seen every player in the world play , but Artie B played flawless one pocket and talk about squeezing every straight shooter I seen him play had the same look on their face of frustration waiting to see a makeable shot . Artie B use to give me a huge spot 9 -7 and the break and without bragging I shot pretty dam straight . The shot he would leave was a one ball maximum total sell out shot from the end rail usually froze and naturally no safe shot either to play . I naturally got frustrated and sold out at times . The thing that about his game is very mis-leading is the fact that he ran out as good as anyone . You give him a shot where you say well the most he can get is 2 balls and the next thing your doing is racking ! Some people might think I'm bias about his game because were great friends , but its hardly the case the man was relentless in his pursuit of victory whether it be squeezing or running out . He took pride on not making any mistakes and ranked other players on the amount of mistakes they make during the game and knew if he had the best of the game ! With me he usually lost count and it was basically a practice session for him the bad part was I had to pay for him to practice everytime . BUT ONCE ! what a record . I would have liked to see Fusco and Artie in battle in there prime . I always had a problem sleeping and I'm sure it would take a longtime before either one would give up a shot .

Phil
 

Terry Ardeno

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The word "smartest" to me conveys the idea of who knows the most intricate moves, tactics, how clusters respond, ect.

Efren has long been "accused" of being able to "see" things in pool that mere mortals can't. His creativity is a result of his pool mind.

But taking this out one step further, I personally think guys like Billy Incardona and Grady Mathews also merit consideration here. Billy, as I recently posted over at AZB, would be my number 1 pick to be my manager if pool players had managers. Nobody is smarter when setting up and nobody thinks as long and hard and seems to never forget factoring in anything important. As for Grady, anyone familiar with him at all can certainly attest to his uncanny ability to figure things out that happen on a pool table. He can kick, hit small targets after going 3 and 4 rails, knows how to nudge (Dallas West uses the term "massage") the balls during shots and on and on.

It seems to me that of all the great players who have done so well in one pocket, these threee stand out. Efren for his creativity, Billy for his management of the game and who he is playing and Grady for his ability to see deeply into even a simple lay out.
 

NH Steve

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Terry Ardeno said:
The word "smartest" to me conveys the idea of who knows the most intricate moves, tactics, how clusters respond, ect.

Efren has long been "accused" of being able to "see" things in pool that mere mortals can't. His creativity is a result of his pool mind.

But taking this out one step further, I personally think guys like Billy Incardona and Grady Mathews also merit consideration here. Billy, as I recently posted over at AZB, would be my number 1 pick to be my manager if pool players had managers. Nobody is smarter when setting up and nobody thinks as long and hard and seems to never forget factoring in anything important. As for Grady, anyone familiar with him at all can certainly attest to his uncanny ability to figure things out that happen on a pool table. He can kick, hit small targets after going 3 and 4 rails, knows how to nudge (Dallas West uses the term "massage") the balls during shots and on and on.

It seems to me that of all the great players who have done so well in one pocket, these threee stand out. Efren for his creativity, Billy for his management of the game and who he is playing and Grady for his ability to see deeply into even a simple lay out.
Terry, I overlooked Grady -- my bad, because he certainly is a guy you would have to consider, also.
 

One Pocket Ghost

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Houston_ron_1966 said:
Ok what makes you the smartest onepocket player in the world

A fair question....Since you're a new member, and may not have seen previous posts of mine, I'll semi-answer it by referring you back to a post I made some weeks ago - And at the bottom of this post is a link to a longer post that I wrote last March about playing perfect/correct One Pocket.....




Hiya Gerry..........Complete, correct, one pocket play, is a matrix - to play one pocket at it's optimum level, is not to play any 'ONE WAY' - anybody doing that is too one dimensional.......To play one pocket correctly, every time you come to the table for your inning, you should have EVERY strategy, EVERY playing style, and EVERY option in your mind to choose from - all depending on what is the optimum choice for that particular situation....The second part is to identify the best choice and execute it - and that correct choice in any and every inning may be very aggressive or very safe, but whichever choice you make, it shouldn't be determined by your emotions or personality, it should be determined by an accurate assessment of ALL contributing factors: opponents tendencies/shot-making/pressure-handling, score, ball layout, table conditions, whose break it was, etc. etc......Sorry if I sound 'very sure of myself', but this is the way to play complete, optimum, one pocket....

....I wrote a lot more about this in a thread that I posted last March - here's the link in case you didn't see it, and would like to >>> http://www.onepocket.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1501
 

One Pocket Ghost

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Since 'Houston_ron_1966' has pm'd me a couple of times re. this topic, I'm going to make another post here....

....Ultimate One Pocket 'smartness/genius' when in a game and coming to the table for your inning, is simply defined by just two things, in this order :

1. Visualization = Viewing the table layout/situation and seeing EVERY possible, viable, shot choice option that exists --- Knowledge, Experience, and Imagination/Creativity are the tools needed for this step.

2. Choosing the very best option after having taken into account every contributing factor/result probability = balls gained vs. balls lost %, ball score, opponent's ability and tendencies, your ability/likelihood % to execute the shot, etc. etc. --- Knowledge, Experience, and Level-headedness are the tools needed for this step.



So, that said, the Smartest (NOT NECESSARILY BEST) One Pocket player in the world, is the player out of all One Pocket players, who can best visualize the table and options to the fullest degree, and who also makes the correct/best shot choice a greater percentage of the time than all other One Pocket players....Who is that player ?....

....Efren ?.....Freddy might think it's him, I might think it's me, Grady, Billy Incardona, Scott Frost, Alan Hopkins, Ike, and Steve Booth :) might think it's them.......We'll never know the answer - it can't be incontestably proven.
 
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fred bentivegna

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On track perception, Ghost

On track perception, Ghost

One Pocket Ghost said:
Since 'Houston_ron_1966' has pm'd me a couple of times re. this topic, I'm going to make another post here....

....Ultimate One Pocket 'smartness/genius' when in a game and coming to the table for your inning, is simply defined by just two things, in this order :

1. Visualization = Viewing the table layout/situation and seeing EVERY possible, viable, shot choice option that exists --- Knowledge, Experience, and Imagination are the tools needed for this step.

2. Choosing the very best option after having taken into account every contributing factor/result probability = balls gained vs. balls lost %, ball score, opponent's ability and tendencies, your ability/likelihood % to execute the shot, etc. etc. --- Knowledge, Experience, and Level-headedness are the tools needed for this step.



So, that said, the Smartest (NOT NECESSARILY BEST) One Pocket player in the world, is the player out of all One Pocket players, who can best visualize the table and options to the fullest degree, and who also makes the correct/best shot choice a greater percentage of the time than all other One Pocket players....Who is that player ?....

....Efren ?.....Freddy might think it's him, I might think it's me, Grady, Billy Incardona, Scott Frost, Alan Hopkins, Ike, and Steve Booth :) might think it's them.......We'll never know the answer - it can't be incontestably proven.

Good description of whats required, Ghost, but you might scare off a few with the enormity of the task.

the Beard
 

Deeman

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I gotta think Grady is pretty smart in strategic play but I never saw a better offensive player than Ronnie. Who is/was the best clutch banker?
 

One Pocket Ghost

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fred bentivegna said:
Good description of whats required, Ghost.

the Beard
Thanks, Freddy.


fred bentivegna said:
but you might scare off a few with the enormity of the task.

the Beard

That's ok Freddy - We don't want no cowards with us in the 'One Pocket foxhole' !
 
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