newbee #5 wwyd

Tom Wirth

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I'm a little surprised that no one commented on newbee #4 but maybe it was too easy or maybe the Christmas holiday being upon us we have better things to do. Whatever, here is part #2 of this theme. If you use part one's proper answer, you will get a good clue as to my solution to this current problem.

Tom
 

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Tom Wirth

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Here is the second image or 3. Sorry I must put each image up separately. In trying to put them all up on the same page the images would only show the file name.

Be careful, the dog will bite if you get the answer wrong.
 

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Island Drive

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Being Very concerned about the ten ball combo being wired I strongly consider lambing up and lagging whitey three rails into the stack and moving the ten ball combo slightly.
 

NH Steve

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If the combos are not wired, that 14-ball bank is pretty damn inviting, and it looks like you could stop the cue ball right there, for a cut on the 2-ball next.
 

One pocket Smitty

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Steve, I'm with you that 14 bank looks real good, however I would draw the CB back to be able to shoot the 8 up table.--Smitty
 

Island Drive

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How about thinnin' the two ball towards your hole and landing whitey on the head rail? Making sure the two ball gets to the bottom rail or in front of your pocket.
 

NH Steve

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Steve, I'm with you that 14 bank looks real good, however I would draw the CB back to be able to shoot the 8 up table.--Smitty
I'd like to draw too, but it looks like if you draw you could draw back into the edge of the stack, which could be bad...
 

androd

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In #4 I would've shot Goldcrown's shot. I can't imaging how the 8 ball changed positions and little else did.
I can understand long rail, short rail off the 13 ball and back into the stack.
That's not possible the way these diagrams end.
Will be interested to see solution. :)
Rod.
 

tucson9ball

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I would do a simple shot. Thin the left side of the 2 ball, slightly pushing it to my side rail. The cue ball would go near my opponents pocket, so he/she couldn't see the 2 ball.
By doing this, he/she would be forced to do a risky bank or just bunt in return.
 

wincardona

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From this position I would kick three cushions (like I was kicking three in the side) with a little speed and play it with the speed to move a ball to my side. But most importantly I would kick hard enough to assure me of reaching the stack off the third cushion and quite possibly 'bury' the cue ball in the stack.

The bank on the 14ball really isn't a "get out of trouble shot" imo it's not a bad shot but not a shot that I wouldn't want my opponent to shoot on me.

Bill Incardona
 

petie

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I agree with Rod in that the solution will be interesting. This is one of those situations where there are a few week shots but no real strong shot...at least apparently. I'll wait to see what Tom does because I know I'll learn something.
 

Tom Wirth

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Being Very concerned about the ten ball combo being wired I strongly consider lambing up and lagging whitey three rails into the stack and moving the ten ball combo slightly.
Bill, The cookie is yours. You were very quick to realize the importance of dislodging the wired combo and saw that the best and easiest way to do that was by going three rails with the kick.

Attempting this task by thinning off the two ball is extremely difficult and risky and it would require a fair amount of inside English as well as a very accurate hit to adjust for the three rail path needed. Being jacked up over the stack makes this a shot not worth the one ball penalty saved. Bite the bullet, pay the one ball and get the job done right.

Dr. Bill, you gave an excellent dissection of the reasoning behind the shot, thanks.

I wanted everyone to notice that in each of these examples there was a wonderful pocket within the stack which offered an inviting place to park the cue ball. Look carefully for these pockets when searching for a location to place the cue ball for your opponent.

I left the straight back as a trap. Yes you may get one ball with that bank but because of the dead ball you must draw the cue ball back to the bottom rail limiting your run to the single ball. Also you may notice shooting that bank requires the cue stick to be jacked up over part of a ball making the shot that much more difficult. And what if you don't make the bank? At best a wasted opportunity to dislodge that dead ball and maintain some control over the table.

Tom
 
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onepockethacker

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Bill, The cookie is yours. You were very quick to realize the importance of dislodging the wired combo and saw that the best and easiest way to do that was by going three rails with the kick.

Attempting this task by thinning off the two ball is extremely difficult and risky and it would require a fair amount of inside English as well as a very accurate hit to adjust for the three rail path needed. Being jacked up over the stack makes this a shot not worth the one ball penalty saved. Bite the bullet, pay the one ball and get the job done right.

Dr. Bill, you gave an excellent dissection of the reasoning behind the shot, thanks.

I wanted everyone to notice that in each of these examples there was a wonderful pocket within the stack which offered an inviting place to park the cue ball. Look carefully for these pockets when searching for a location to place the cue ball for your opponent.

Tom
So what will you do if when you take the scratch kicking 3 rails and you hit the 6 ball dead in the face, leaving your opponent the cut on the 8 ball and he cuts it in and tuns out? ... :sorry
 

Tom Wirth

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So what will you do if when you take the scratch kicking 3 rails and you hit the 6 ball dead in the face, leaving your opponent the cut on the 8 ball and he cuts it in and tuns out? ... :sorry
Rob, that angle is not there. I defy you to find the angle you are describing. Secondly, with a little practice which is something we can all stand to do, the shot can be controlled quite accurately. You know this, and I understand you are playing a little devil's advocate with me but it's Christmas buddy. Let the devil take a couple days off.

Tom
 

jtompilot

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Here is the result of the shot.
I'm sorry Tom but I don't see this as a good shot. You went from a poor spot to a worse spot. Sure you bumped a few balls but there is a good return from there.

I'm going to thin the 11, QB three rails behind the 2. Now your worse off. I think anyways.
 

Tom Wirth

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I'm sorry Tom but I don't see this as a good shot. You went from a poor spot to a worse spot. Sure you bumped a few balls but there is a good return from there.

I'm going to thin the 11, QB three rails behind the 2. Now your worse off. I think anyways.
Jim, with all due respect, saying and doing are two different things. To claim you can thin off the eleven ball with accuracy while jacked up over not just one ball but several balls, and all the while apply the proper English and speed to fall behind the two sufficiently to hinder an adequate response is in my estimation biting off more than most anyone can chew.

And to counter your statement that I merely bumped a few ball is hardly accurate. I disturbed a dead ball which was lined up in such a way that to break that combo up I had only the one path at my disposal. Breaking up that dead ball was a critical element to the shot I chose.

I suggest you set up this scenario and attempt the shot you have envisioned and see for yourself how difficult a task you have set for yourself.

Nice try though. :)

Tom
 

jtompilot

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Jim, with all due respect, saying and doing are two different things. To claim you can thin off the eleven ball with accuracy while jacked up over not just one ball but several balls, and all the while apply the proper English and speed to fall behind the two sufficiently to hinder an adequate response is in my estimation biting off more than most anyone can chew.

And to counter your statement that I merely bumped a few ball is hardly accurate. I disturbed a dead ball which was lined up in such a way that to break that combo up I had only the one path at my disposal. Breaking up that dead ball was a critical element to the shot I chose.

I suggest you set up this scenario and attempt the shot you have envisioned and see for yourself how difficult a task you have set for yourself.

Nice try though. :)

Tom
I'm sure your right Tom. I'm giving a little yeng and yang or something like that:)

Anyways, great threads and I'm enjoying them.
I'll try and find a table and set it up tomorrow.
 
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