More Chicago stuff

SJDinPHX

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Grady said:
I was "with it" for a time. I was good at it too but you get to where you think everybody is a mark. I learned the ropes being an alibi agent and soon graduated into a first rate count store agent. I quickly noticed that I was the only one who wasn't either a drug addict or an alcoholic. I tired of the lifestyle.
I worked with Walter Gaste and Moore's Modern and then Murphy's out of Kearney, NE. I knew Larry Woods well, who was a pretty fair One Pocket player, considering that he was not much of a shotmaker. I played him 8 to 5 and that was a fair game. Most of you won't know these names but they bring back vivid memories to me.
Well, you've done it again Grady ! Talk about "vivid memories".
In the late 50's, when I first started frequenting Cochran's, I played mostly nine ball, or golf. As you know, there were few 9 baller's in that joint.
I couldn't even spell one pocket at that time. Enter Mr. Larry Woods.
He was my first one pocket score. He'd seen me struggle at the 1P games I made with Rusty Jones, Sleepy Bob, and Perkin's, So he thought I looked like a mark at one of his "flat stores". The "mark" bit back, and he went off pretty good.
I think Perkin's was in with him, I'm not sure, in any event that was the time I got Jack pretty good on that 9 ball prop game, where he gives me the 5 ball, and he wins if he makes the 9 hit the head rail. He had NO chance (on a 5X10 ) at that game. He took the heat and had the whole joint in stitches, because everyone liked to see Jack go off, in a (rare) trap.

If I remember right, Wood's was still coming in during your tenure at Cochran's, wasn't he ? Good mem's Grady. Thanks

Dick
 
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SJDinPHX

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fred bentivegna said:
I'm already pissed off, Dick. This started out as semi-friendly banter and woofin' but it deviated into name-calling, insults and braggadocio. I dont like the fact that somebody I have supported and acknowledged so much would turn on me, disrespect me as a player, call me a traitor and a bullsh*tter just because we dont see eye to eye on what happened 20 years ago. Has anybody noticed that I have supported and defended this guy on these forums for the last 4 years? One disagreement and he throws me under the bus and accuses me of making up stories with Grady. And incidentally, Dick, I'm speaking to you because you know where I'm coming from, I wouldnt change not one thing I did in my pool career, insofar as my "sucker" habits of playing tough action all over the country and gunfighting with top players. Money was just chips to use in order to fund my "bad game" habit. Thats what I wanted to do, and thats what I did. I'm comfortable with the choices I made. I got good friends all over the country. If I go to visit my pal Little Sammy Eubank in Hot Springs AR, when I hit the city line he puts $500 in my pocket and forces me to take it. Then he'll wine and dine me the whole time I'm there. That's the way the old guard is supposed to act with each other. (Incidentally, when I was coked up at North Shore Billiards, and goin' off, he usually bet against me. I understood, and still loved him.) So unless that other guy we been talking about throws me a bone, and says that I really aint a traitor or bullsh*tter we aint gonna be pals no more.

the Beard
Freddie, I understand where you're coming from. You surely know that when you and I, and the Ghost, started trading barbs about the Chicago contingent,
we thought it was all in fun. Apparently, something struck a nerve with Artie,
and he chose to lash out at you. It was certainly not MY intention to cause a rift in your old friendship. ( I can't speak for the Ghost though :rolleyes: )
Seriously, I hope you guy's bury the hatchet soon, and lets get back to having fun and telling war stories.

Sincerely,

Dick
 
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Grady

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Thanks, Dick

Thanks, Dick

Your memory is pretty solid, too, buddy. I actually played Larry at Cochran's and in Sacramento. I saw you play in Cochran's, the time you beat Lopez in a long set. I was a big admirer of your game and the way you comported yourself. You probably wouldn't have noticed me because I was just a kid and totally entranced by Cochran's and it's habitues.
 

Fatboy

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Who is the fat guy in the wheel chair next to Buddy?, buddy sure looks small in that pic.

this is a great thread, thx gentalmen
 

fred bentivegna

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New pals

New pals

Dick Mc Morran said:
Freddie, I understand where you're coming from. You surely know that when you and I, and the Ghost, started trading barbs about the Chicago contingent,
we thought it was all in fun. Apparently, something struck a nerve with Artie,
and he chose to lash out at you. It was certainly not MY intention to cause a rift in your old friendship. ( I can't speak for the Ghost though :rolleyes: )
Seriously, I hope you guy's bury the hatchet soon, and lets get back to having fun and telling war stories.

Sincerely,

Dick
It's time for new pals, Dick, and I've decided I'm hanging with you (if you'll have me) the whole time at DCC. So therefore, I aint gonna rob you playin' banks and I aint gonna trick you playin' 1pkt.
Wuz listening to some old Woodstock era hippie tunes last night on my car radio, boy do I miss those times, Gracie Slick, Stevie Nix, (my old heart-throbs), Allman Bros.,etc., now that was music!

the Beard
 

gulfportdoc

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fred bentivegna said:
Wuz listening to some old Woodstock era hippie tunes last night on my car radio, boy do I miss those times, Gracie Slick, Stevie Nix, (my old heart-throbs), Allman Bros.,etc., now that was music!
I'm partial to the Mothers Of Invention (Zappa). However I do have a certain fond reminiscence for some of the era's acid crap.:D

Doc
 

fred bentivegna

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Sorry, Doc

Sorry, Doc

gulfportdoc said:
I'm partial to the Mothers Of Invention (Zappa). However I do have a certain fond reminiscence for some of the era's acid crap.:D

Doc
Didnt mean to slight you there, Doc. A lot of the boys might not know that you played with Zappa in your wilder days. I still remember that album cover he (Zappa) did where he was sitting on a toilet. Were you with him then?

the Beard
 

SJDinPHX

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fred bentivegna said:
Didnt mean to slight you there, Doc. A lot of the boys might not know that you played with Zappa in your wilder days. I still remember that album cover he (Zappa) did where he was sitting on a toilet. Were you with him then?

the Beard
Sorry guy's, my musical heroes were Billie Holiday, Lena Horne, Rudy Vallee,and Bing Crosby. Then that young upstart, Sinatra came along and screwed everything up. :rolleyes:

Dick,

PS My grandkids did get me to liking Elvis tho. :cool:
 

gulfportdoc

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fred bentivegna said:
Didnt mean to slight you there, Doc. A lot of the boys might not know that you played with Zappa in your wilder days. I still remember that album cover he (Zappa) did where he was sitting on a toilet. Were you with him then?
Yes, but I never sat on the toilet with him. I was in MOI from '67-'69. It wasn't that I was wild. It was just that everyone else was square. That info + $1.25 gets you a cup of coffee at Waffle House...:D

Doc
 

Fast Lenny

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One Pocket Art said:
Hi Grady Are you with it? That means that he is one of usa carnie. And if you worked a count down store that means you are a graduate and qualified to beat they MARKS. And they carnnies think everybody is a sucker but them. And if you lose all they time I cant make you a winner. Losing more moey then what you win buts you in they MARK catagory. And if a pool hustler keeps beating somebody what would you call they guy he is beating. A winner or a loser. Lots of people are adicted to losing and they keep losing theirs whole life and if you win at one thing and lose your money in another thing that still makes you a sucker even if you win your money from suckers.They greatest lession you can learn in life is dont lose at anything. And if you lose more then you win you need to change games. If you are a good hustler you can talk anybody into anything just keep talking tell you get what you need to win or dont play. Never play a game that you have they worst of they percentages. Because they result will be minus. Why would you want to play something you cant win at. And only suckers play to get lucky. Because thats their excuse for losing. I learned how to hustle in they carnivale from Cookie Edie and Alabie Al and Hickie Callpeper on Royale American Show.And I learned how to work they flat stores. These Flat store agents could talk you into buying they golden gate bridge.And they were great. And they did it all by talking. Their all in they history books now. Because they FBI put them out of buisness. And closed all they flat stories. BUt it took them 2 generations to figure it out and what was going on. They were a little slow.And today they only have hankie pank jointe. And they are on they square. If you win they give you a price that cost less then they game. And all they are doing is selling plush. Some agents made giant scores. They carnival was my learning experience. If you cant win dont play. And everybody is a potential mark. I have a million stories and events what we did to win. It prepaired me for life.Not for a book education but a street education were you can survive in any country or city by noing what to do. Hustling is glamouras and exciting thats why Minnesota Fats always got Willie Mosconies goat. Even though Fats couldnt beat willy MOsconie in no pool game. He did it all by talking. And remember only suckers gamble to get lucky. Because they finale result will be you will lose all your money. And you have to hustle hard or win a tournament to get more money to lose on a game you will not win at. If you think what I am righting is not they truth or boring I will stop right hir and not go any further. And if one person learns something I will be happy. And I amm sorry if I ofended or hurt someones feeling. And everybody will be O. K. Have a great day.
Hey Artie,I am taking notes so keep talking brother,I see and hear everything,its knowledge in my head and money in my pocket,thanks! :)
 

jay helfert

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gulfportdoc said:
I'm partial to the Mothers Of Invention (Zappa). However I do have a certain fond reminiscence for some of the era's acid crap.:D

Doc

Doc,

Did you remember the "Castle" they had on Laurel Canyon Dr. in L.A.? I was there once, loaded on acid. True story.
 

gulfportdoc

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jay helfert said:
Doc,

Did you remember the "Castle" they had on Laurel Canyon Dr. in L.A.? I was there once, loaded on acid. True story.
You're probably referring to the palatial estate just north of the Tom Mix log cabin on Lookout Mt. Rd. & Laurel Canyon Blvd. where Zappa lived (and we rehearsed) during 1968. The "castle" had been owned by a silent movie star (I forget which one), and as I recall was managed by an old woman who didn't care too much who stayed there. As a result it quickly turned into sort of a feak house where sex, drugs and rock 'n roll proliferated.

Across the street from the old Mix home was the ruins of Houdini's castle, which had significantly burned years before. The Mix estate burned down in 1981. For all I know the castle north of Mix's place still stands.

Wild 'n crazy days, baby~

Doc
 

Fast Lenny

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gulfportdoc said:
You're probably referring to the palatial estate just north of the Tom Mix log cabin on Lookout Mt. Rd. & Laurel Canyon Blvd. where Zappa lived (and we rehearsed) during 1968. The "castle" had been owned by a silent movie star (I forget which one), and as I recall was managed by an old woman who didn't care too much who stayed there. As a result it quickly turned into sort of a feak house where sex, drugs and rock 'n roll proliferated.

Across the street from the old Mix home was the ruins of Houdini's castle, which had significantly burned years before. The Mix estate burned down in 1981. For all I know the castle north of Mix's place still stands.

Wild 'n crazy days, baby~

Doc
Yeah both places burned down on Halloween 22 years apart. :cool:
 

Fatboy

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jay helfert said:
Doc,

Did you remember the "Castle" they had on Laurel Canyon Dr. in L.A.? I was there once, loaded on acid. True story.
My house is on Laural Canyon Dr. not a street over but dead bang on it, down the hill.

Fatboy<------is a square and never did acid.
 

cashrider

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gulfportdoc said:
You're probably referring to the palatial estate just north of the Tom Mix log cabin on Lookout Mt. Rd. & Laurel Canyon Blvd. where Zappa lived (and we rehearsed) during 1968. The "castle" had been owned by a silent movie star (I forget which one), and as I recall was managed by an old woman who didn't care too much who stayed there. As a result it quickly turned into sort of a feak house where sex, drugs and rock 'n roll proliferated.

Across the street from the old Mix home was the ruins of Houdini's castle, which had significantly burned years before. The Mix estate burned down in 1981. For all I know the castle north of Mix's place still stands.

Wild 'n crazy days, baby~

Doc
Hello Doc, back in those daysl was drummer /singer from chicago.doing agig in iowa one if the ladies l met took me home and tourned me on to Zappa,l was never the same after that, the album featured George Duke l believe ,some of the songs ; camarillo brillo."she had that camarillo ,riding out along the fence, l mean hermendazino beano ,by words buzanated red,she ruled the toads of the short forest and every knut idaho, and carried on without a comma theat she was someone l should know...[[f'kin outstanding]] and l still cant get those lyrics outta my head..and l like it like that,,,Doc what did you play..? My next musical awakening was John mcclauhin and the mahavishnu orchestra ,,after hearing Billy Cobham play .l realized what l was doing was not playing,,so l put down my sticks
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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SactownTom said:
Wasn't it Ronnie Allen that said he wanted to be the 'Sucker'? He said it seems all the 'Suckers" he'd met and played all had MONEY... they all had money!!!
And the all had jobs too. ASk me any qoustion you want to no the answer to. Now is a good time while I dont have much to do. And the quistions you ask I will give you a honest answer. I will tell you the truth. I am no looking to make up stories. I said it many times I can improve anyones game. Even the champions. Why would people not what to no the asnswer to improve their game. Especialy a young player who wants to become a champion.One pocket is NOT A GUESSING GAME. AND CHICAGO IS THE CAPITAL OF ONE POCKET AND BANK POOL IN THE WORLD.
 

cashrider

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One Pocket Art said:
And the all had jobs too. ASk me any qoustion you want to no the answer to. Now is a good time while I dont have much to do. And the quistions you ask I will give you a honest answer. I will tell you the truth. I am no looking to make up stories. I said it many times I can improve anyones game. Even the champions. Why would people not what to no the asnswer to improve their game. Especialy a young player who wants to become a champion.One pocket is NOT A GUESSING GAME. AND CHICAGO IS THE CAPITAL OF ONE POCKET AND BANK POOL IN THE WORLD.

am l correct that you have a 30dimes challenge open in onepocket or was it to train someone?
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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cashrider said:
am l correct that you have a 30dimes challenge open in onepocket or was it to train someone?
The chalange was we each get one houer to explain they perfect and the correct way to play one pocket. We each get one houer before a panal of 5 judges that we both pick and agree to. And the judges will pick the winner. I will train sombody for 6 months for 30 thousand dollares And they will be the only person out side of me how to play perfect one pocket. And you can sell they DVD if you want to sell it and the chinnese will pay for it. Because they are great copiers and perfectionasts and they will copy it and learn it because the are into perfection. And A guy like Archer could learn one pocket and in 6 monthes he would be in the top 5 one pocket players in the world. And in one year he could become the best one pocket player in the world. Because he is a very talanted and has a lot of ability and they tools to be the best all he is lacking is the knowledge. And if nobody wants it its ok with me. Because I am not giving away what I no for nothing. Unless some body wants to buy it for 30 thousand dollares and sell it to some one else or figure out how to make more money with it. I no if I was a true one pocket player and I was young again. And no what I no now I would buy it. Its a steel for the price.
 
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