Josh Roberts vs Mike Davis WWYD

LSJohn

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Davis is up 2 games to 1 in a race to 5. Davis to shoot. His pocket is bottom right in this first pic. Davis broke but the break advantage has been reversed and no balls have been made. WWYD?





 

Miller

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if you can carom off the deuce into the pink stripe, the 11 looks wired....
:)
 

Tom Wirth

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I know many will disagree with me here but from looking at the second image, the bank looks to be a high percentage shot. I'm banking the stripe ball and drawing my cue ball for a second bank on the nine. No safety play here. The safety is in making the first bank. And why not? Without this bank there is big trouble for the shooter, but this simple bank will solve all woes.

Sometimes you just have to shoot and this looks to me like as good a time as any I've seen.

Tom
 

Frank Almanza

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I know many will disagree with me here but from looking at the second image, the bank looks to be a high percentage shot. I'm banking the stripe ball and drawing my cue ball for a second bank on the nine. No safety play here. The safety is in making the first bank. And why not? Without this bank there is big trouble for the shooter, but this simple bank will solve all woes.

Sometimes you just have to shoot and this looks to me like as good a time as any I've seen.

Tom
I agree with all you say except for the draw back part. If you miss it and leave it close you've left nothing good for him. He will have to deal with that stripe near your pocket. If you play the bank and make it while stopping the cue ball there you will be in position to get the one ball to your side and protect it.
 

gulfportdoc

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If the opponent can't make the 3, I like banking the 1 into the stack, and stunning the CB up to the head rail by the pocket. That shot would push a lot of stuff over to my hole. If you can bank the 1 low enough to hit the 5 (doesn't look like you can), which should put the 11 by the hole. The carom bank on the 2-11 likewise doesn't appear makeable; but if it is, there wouldn't be much to follow up with.

If the 3 does go by the 14 for the opponent, I too might take a swing at the 10 ball bank, since the CB is so close. Otherwise the 1 can be banked over to the shooter's side, and freeze the CB to the stack. The danger with that shot is that the shooter has to guard on leaving a bank on the 6.

~Doc
 

LSJohn

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Davis took some time and finally banked the 10. He missed and Josh eventually won the game to tie the score at 2 each.

Mike Davis is a good player, and in the first half of the 5th game he played extremely well, but a couple of bad rolls cost him. He played a little ragged at times in this match and Josh was not at his best either.
 

NH Steve

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For me it is not so easy to stroke a bank like the straight back on the 10, with the cue ball that close to the 10. Because i have to shorten up my normal follow through to avoid a double hit, everything changes and it is not as easy to control speed and/or the degree of draw, follow or stop. Of course hindsight is 20-20 but I don't think I would have banked the 10 unless the cue ball was an inch or so farther away from it.
 

cincy_kid

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depends how I feel at the moment but if I am playing well I shoot the 10 and draw back for the bank on the 9 as Tom said. Not to mention its one of the few shots I even see. You cant shoot the 1 and stick in the pack because he has the bank on the 6. You could bank the 10 and stop behind the pack but if you make it, then what?

The only other thing I would think about here is a 3 rail kick, short to hit the long rail and the back side of the 3 for a safety.

But this is tough spot and I may go down swinging at that 10 and trying to get shape.
 

petie

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If the opponent can't make the 3, I like banking the 1 into the stack, and stunning the CB up to the head rail by the pocket. That shot would push a lot of stuff over to my hole. If you can bank the 1 low enough to hit the 5 (doesn't look like you can), which should put the 11 by the hole. The carom bank on the 2-11 likewise doesn't appear makeable; but if it is, there wouldn't be much to follow up with.

If the 3 does go by the 14 for the opponent, I too might take a swing at the 10 ball bank, since the CB is so close. Otherwise the 1 can be banked over to the shooter's side, and freeze the CB to the stack. The danger with that shot is that the shooter has to guard on leaving a bank on the 6.

~Doc
I like your shot, Doc. Move the furniture and leave him tripled up on the head rail. What's not to like?
 

cincy_kid

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I like your shot, Doc. Move the furniture and leave him tripled up on the head rail. What's not to like?
I like this shot as well and use it often in matches. The only thing I wasn't sure about in this particular layout is how far you can move the CB towards the head rail. The bank the 1 into the stack doesn't provide much of an angle or otherwise you will hit the 3 ball and bad things could happen.

Maybe you shoot that shot bu use some high left and get the ball up table that way?

Either way I like this shot better than shooting the 10 and stopping but I still favor banking the 10 at my hole and drawing for shape on the 9.
 

wincardona

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If the opponent can't make the 3, I like banking the 1 into the stack, and stunning the CB up to the head rail by the pocket. That shot would push a lot of stuff over to my hole. If you can bank the 1 low enough to hit the 5 (doesn't look like you can), which should put the 11 by the hole. The carom bank on the 2-11 likewise doesn't appear makeable; but if it is, there wouldn't be much to follow up with.

If the 3 does go by the 14 for the opponent, I too might take a swing at the 10 ball bank, since the CB is so close. Otherwise the 1 can be banked over to the shooter's side, and freeze the CB to the stack. The danger with that shot is that the shooter has to guard on leaving a bank on the 6.

~Doc
Doc, playing off the 1ball looks to be very risky for several reasons. From the angle the picture shows there really isn't much of an angle to move the cue ball off of, looks like the angle is too awkward to stun the cue ball up table. Another method of playing the cue ball from the position seen here would be to follow the cue ball with top "extreme left english" hitting it with a medium speed. This method of playing the cue ball is much more predictable in controlling the cue ball to a specific area of the table. In this situation if I were to play off the 1ball I would play the cue ball to the top left quadrant of the table using the side rail then the opposite side rail then dropping softly to the top rail by the top left pocket. The 9ball doesn't look like it can be pocketed from the ending position but the 3ball may have a chance to slide by the 14 and 9ball..looks close. If the 3ball does have a pocket it's not much of a pocket, plus I would rather my opponent shoot the 3ball from the top left quadrant then from the top right quadrant, in terms of his accuracy with the hit.

Considering how Mike played the position indicates that either the 1ball wasn't a good option, or if it was then the 3ball had too much of an open pocket to gamble by playing off the 1ball.

Tom Wirth's option with playing all out by banking the 10ball is certainly worth considering, especially if you are confident with your banks.

Dr. Bill
 

cincy_kid

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Doc, playing off the 1ball looks to be very risky for several reasons. From the angle the picture shows there really isn't much of an angle to move the cue ball off of, looks like the angle is too awkward to stun the cue ball up table. Another method of playing the cue ball from the position seen here would be to follow the cue ball with top "extreme left english" hitting it with a medium speed. This method of playing the cue ball is much more predictable in controlling the cue ball to a specific area of the table. In this situation if I were to play off the 1ball I would play the cue ball to the top left quadrant of the table using the side rail then the opposite side rail then dropping softly to the top rail by the top left pocket. The 9ball doesn't look like it can be pocketed from the ending position but the 3ball may have a chance to slide by the 14 and 9ball..looks close. If the 3ball does have a pocket it's not much of a pocket, plus I would rather my opponent shoot the 3ball from the top left quadrant then from the top right quadrant, in terms of his accuracy with the hit.

Considering how Mike played the position indicates that either the 1ball wasn't a good option, or if it was then the 3ball had too much of an open pocket to gamble by playing off the 1ball.

Tom Wirth's option with playing all out by banking the 10ball is certainly worth considering, especially if you are confident with your banks.

Dr. Bill
I know I am on the right track when Dr. Bill agrees with part of my post! :)
 

gulfportdoc

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Doc, playing off the 1ball looks to be very risky for several reasons. From the angle the picture shows there really isn't much of an angle to move the cue ball off of, looks like the angle is too awkward to stun the cue ball up table. Another method of playing the cue ball from the position seen here would be to follow the cue ball with top "extreme left english" hitting it with a medium speed. ... Dr. Bill
Well, the shooter has almost a half ball hit available on the 1 ball. Keep in mind that the 1 will come very short off the side rail due to the collision induced english. Of course that would be ruined by your left hand spin.(jk:)) Yes, the shooter could shoot through the 1 with high left if he wanted.

But there again, I wouldn't shoot that shot if the 3 goes clean in the corner.

~Doc
 

petie

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Well, the shooter has almost a half ball hit available on the 1 ball. Keep in mind that the 1 will come very short off the side rail due to the collision induced english. Of course that would be ruined by your left hand spin.(jk:)) Yes, the shooter could shoot through the 1 with high left if he wanted.

But there again, I wouldn't shoot that shot if the 3 goes clean in the corner.

~Doc
Yes, I'm assuming when you leave him up table, he is tripled up to his pocket. If the three goes, find another shot.
 

baby huey

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This is a tough situation to be in. I don't see any home run shots that could turn the tables in one inning. I wouldn't open up the stack in any way. My shot would be to hit the ten ball thin on its left side and freeze the cue ball on the side rail as close to the side pocket as is possible. If possible let him look only at the ten ball and make him try to come up with some shot where he leaves me in the stack which I think would be hard to do. Like I always say, make him keep the heat on me if he can. There are always intentional scratches available. Lastly, you just have to be patient playing one pocket as no body is perfect in keeping the heat on every shot.
 

LSJohn

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My shot would be to hit the ten ball thin on its left side and freeze the cue ball on the side rail as close to the side pocket as is possible. If possible let him look only at the ten ball
Doesn't surprise me a bit to think you've come up with the best shot. We tend to look for hero shots -- probably even more so in these WWYDs than at the table -- but patience here is probably best.

"Don't leave 'em on the wrong side of the stack" sometimes blinds me to the best shot when it's an exception to that.

Thanks!
 

Tom Wirth

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This is a tough situation to be in. I don't see any home run shots that could turn the tables in one inning.

[Jerry, you don't see how banking the ten straight back and drawing the cue ball for a second bank on the nine would not change the tables in one inning?[/I]

I wouldn't open up the stack in any way. This I agree with completely.

My shot would be to hit the ten ball thin on its left side and freeze the cue ball on the side rail as close to the side pocket as is possible. If possible let him look only at the ten ball and make him try to come up with some shot where he leaves me in the stack which I think would be hard to do.
Why must he leave the cue ball on the stack? Your shot will certainly guarantee a delay but will also likely develop into an escalation of the troubles for this player. With so many loose balls surrounding his hole your opponent should have numerous options available

Like I always say, make him keep the heat on me if he can. There are always intentional scratches available. Lastly, you just have to be patient playing one pocket as no body is perfect in keeping the heat on every shot.
Jerry, you are certainly an expert at surviving these situations longer than most, and you are correct that patience in One Pocket is a virtue, but on the other hand the advantage remains with the player with the balls in front of his hole. In this situation that advantage is only likely to grow stronger until something proactive is done to change this layout. Personally, I don't like leaving my fate in the hands of an opponent who has strong One Pocket skills, especially when I have a viable opportunity to turn the tables on him. Opportunities sometimes only knock once. Of course, if your banking skills are not up to the task and the percentages of your making this bank are not favorable then the bank on the ten would not be a good option.

Tom
 
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Jeff sparks

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I'm gonna leave him a shot on the 3 ball, thin the 10 & go to his long rail above the side pocket with the CB and freeze him on the joint as straight in as possible on the 3 ball. I would welcome him to shot at the 3 from there.
 

Tom Wirth

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I'm gonna leave him a shot on the 3 ball, thin the 10 & go to his long rail above the side pocket with the CB and freeze him on the joint as straight in as possible on the 3 ball. I would welcome him to shot at the 3 from there.
Jeff, the down side to your shot is that if you will have given your opponent the option to shoot at the three. The only reason to shoot the three would be if he liked the possibilities and had confidence in the outcome. If he didn't like it he would have a few other things he could do which have no risk and yet keep you in the doghouse. Either way, you are giving up good choices to your opponent and the only way you benefit is if he dogs it bad.

Tom
 
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