Efren Vs Frost At Dcc

lll

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Bernie P. mentioned scott's playing efren 11 ahead for 10k at the DCC
thoughts anyone on how they are playing NOW and likely outcome??
 

Fast Lenny

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They are playing even with the dates being the 21st and 22nd. I will be there for it and think Scott will win but he does not have to win, probably the best match to bet for pure gambling. :)
 

CaliRed

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Fast Lenny said:
They are playing even with the dates being the 21st and 22nd. I will be there for it and think Scott will win but he does not have to win, probably the best match to bet for pure gambling. :)
Do we know how this thing all came about? I'm always curious how these types of matches get started? Did Accu-stats get ahold of both players and ask if they would do anything as a special type of match?

I don't get in till 10:00 friday, so tell them not to start anything until I get checked in and everything:D What a perfect way to start the Derby off!
 

wincardona

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lll said:
Bernie P. mentioned scott's playing efren 11 ahead for 10k at the DCC
thoughts anyone on how they are playing NOW and likely outcome??
I doubt that they are playing 11 ahead, probably a race to 11 sounds more likely.

My take on this match up is that it will be a close match, but I feel Reyes should be a slight favorite, considering he will have time to prepare for the match. If they were playing daily, I would make Scott a favorite because of the age difference. Energy plays a major role in matches, particularly when there is an age gap between the players. In this particular match a race to 11 is somewhat taxing and should favor Frost if they were to play straight through. If they break it up between 2 days then Reyes imo deserves the slight nod.

What ever happens i'm sure we will be treated to some of the finest one pocket possible.:cool: There is no doubt that the top two one pocket players in the world are Reyes and Frost, and in no particular order. I believe this match will be won by 1 or 2 games by either player, no more. :eek:

I have played both players a number of times and have felt their strengths, and this is going to be a hell of a great match that one shouldn't miss if possible. Their both monster players.:D
Trust me, i'm a doctor.

Billy I.
 

Fast Lenny

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CaliRed said:
Do we know how this thing all came about? I'm always curious how these types of matches get started? Did Accu-stats get ahold of both players and ask if they would do anything as a special type of match?

I don't get in till 10:00 friday, so tell them not to start anything until I get checked in and everything:D What a perfect way to start the Derby off!
I am arriving on Friday also, I imagine it will be a night match but not sure on the time. The match has been talked about for awhile but things just needed to get some kinks worked out and Accustats is the best to do this. They did this last year and it was a good match with Scott winning but this is a longer race over 2 days so we shall see. I look forward to meeting you. :)
 

CaliRed

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wincardona said:
I doubt that they are playing 11 ahead, probably a race to 11 sounds more likely.

My take on this match up is that it will be a close match, but I feel Reyes should be a slight favorite, considering he will have time to prepare for the match. If they were playing daily, I would make Scott a favorite because of the age difference. Energy plays a major role in matches, particularly when there is an age gap between the players. In this particular match a race to 11 is somewhat taxing and should favor Frost if they were to play straight through. If they break it up between 2 days then Reyes imo deserves the slight nod.

What ever happens i'm sure we will be treated to some of the finest one pocket possible.:cool: There is no doubt that the top two one pocket players in the world are Reyes and Frost, and in no particular order. I believe this match will be won by 1 or 2 games by either player, no more. :eek:

I have played both players a number of times and have felt their strengths, and this is going to be a hell of a great match that one shouldn't miss if possible. Their both monster players.:D
Trust me, i'm a doctor.

Billy I.
I sure hope you're in the booth! I would want to buy this match once it comes out and I love your commentating (no homo):D I really don't like Danny's commentating, but that's a personal preference, nothing against him personally. You on the other hand, could be commentating on Viffer and Fatboy playing for 100.00 and I would watch the match:eek:
 

lll

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wincardona said:
I doubt that they are playing 11 ahead, probably a race to 11 sounds more likely.

My take on this match up is that it will be a close match, but I feel Reyes should be a slight favorite, considering he will have time to prepare for the match. If they were playing daily, I would make Scott a favorite because of the age difference. Energy plays a major role in matches, particularly when there is an age gap between the players. In this particular match a race to 11 is somewhat taxing and should favor Frost if they were to play straight through. If they break it up between 2 days then Reyes imo deserves the slight nod.

What ever happens i'm sure we will be treated to some of the finest one pocket possible.:cool: There is no doubt that the top two one pocket players in the world are Reyes and Frost, and in no particular order. I believe this match will be won by 1 or 2 games by either player, no more. :eek:

I have played both players a number of times and have felt their strengths, and this is going to be a hell of a great match that one shouldn't miss if possible. Their both monster players.:D
Trust me, i'm a doctor.

Billy I.
i beleive efren has lost twice to scott playing even.ICBW
if this is correct why do you think NOW in 2011 efren still has a chance and the batton has not been passed to the next generation ???
just askin:)
 

Fast Lenny

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lll said:
i beleive efren has lost twice to scott playing even.ICBW
if this is correct why do you think NOW in 2011 efren still has a chance and the batton has not been passed to the next generation ???
just askin:)
I think Billy believes Efren will be prepared and rested and its a longer set but broken up over 2 days. I think Frost is a favorite in a straight long race or an ahead set but this is a coin flip for sure. Where is Dr. Billy? :)
 

stevelomako

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lll said:
i beleive efren has lost twice to scott playing even.ICBW
if this is correct why do you think NOW in 2011 efren still has a chance and the batton has not been passed to the next generation ???
just askin:)
Because Dippy is staking Bata and he'll be front row and center. Every time Scott will be shooting he's going to start counting money in front of him.
 

wincardona

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lll said:
i beleive efren has lost twice to scott playing even.ICBW
if this is correct why do you think NOW in 2011 efren still has a chance and the batton has not been passed to the next generation ???
just askin:)
As Reyes ages I agree that his chances lessens, but I still think he's capable of playing brilliantly if he's able to prepare. When Frost beat Reyes it was at night after long hrs. of tournament play.where Reyes tank may have been on half full before they started. It was never Scotts intention to play position on Reyes in terms of possible endurance problems, he Scott just wanted to play. I feel that if Reyes has rest and is prepared to play it will be a differen't type of match. What ever happens it will be a match for the ages and one , one shouldn't miss.

If Scott wins this match he will then have solidified his #1 ranking as the best one pocket player in the world today. But it's certainly not going to be easy, by any means. Definitely a match you can't afford to miss.

Billy I.
 

wincardona

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stevelomako said:
Because Dippy is staking Bata and he'll be front row and center. Every time Scott will be shooting he's going to start counting money in front of him.
Startin shit again.;)

Billy I.
 

stevelomako

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wincardona said:
Startin shit again.;)

Billy I.
Think something like that wouldn't happen where I grew up?

It'd make you step up and play and get some seasoning for sure.
 

bernie p

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This is going to be an epic match, no doubt. Perhaps the one pocket match of the decade?

There are certainly many who would (arguably) say that Frost and Reyes are currently the two best 1P players in the world today. I believe, as it stands today, it is truly a coin flip.

Efren at age 56 is currently giving up approx 30 years on the wire and yet his recent successes in last couple of years seem to defy the theory that very few major titles are attained in today's billiard arena for the "over 40".

Up until as recently as 2 or 3 years ago Scott had not beaten Efren, even with a couple of ball handicap. Within the last 2 years, I believe Scott has beaten Efren 3 out of 4 times, playing even, for the cash (please correct me if I am wrong).

So psychologically, you could argue that Scott's game has come of age and mentally he is, no doubt, ready. Scott's as the reigning DCC 1P Champion returns to the Derby as the man to beat.

At 56, Efren knows that his 1P reign must come to an end in the foreseeable future but I am not yet quite convinced that we are there today. You might argue that the results of previous short race battles are somewhat inconclusive as to who actually is the "best". Yes, a race to 11 is perhaps more telling but unless the score is a landslide, then a one or two rack difference is essentially of little consequence, beyond bragging rights.

From a "strengths" point of view the differences are very minor and subtle. I believe that Efren has a slight advantage in the early-game moving/tickying area but his eyes are not as young, and his long range "gotta" shoot at shots are perhaps 1 or 2 percent less accurate than the Efren of a few years ago. Both run balls with amazing skill but for the first time ever I believe that Scott is dissecting the pack and manufacturing balls better than Efren. (I know....I know, that's a brazen statement:eek: )

In recent years many Frost detractors have argued that he shoots too aggressively and would eventually succumb to Efren's moving skills however I have personally witnessed a certain level of maturing in Scott's game within the last 18 months, to the point that I feel his current blend of offense/defense to be optimal for modern day 1P Champion standards.

I suspect Efren will be in serious practice with some very skilled competition prior to the match. I believe Scott's biggest challenge will be the lack of tough sparring partners to make him battle ready. Having said that, I have seen Scott with virtually no table time in many weeks, step up and play world class within a few hours. In my book, that is truly the definition of talent/legend.

So....my fellow 1P prognosticators.....what does this all mean? Well.....if you are still a staunch Efren fan, then an Efren win by any score, would solidify his no.1 ranking.
A narrow win (1 or 2 games) by Scott may not totally sway the old Efren Guard.
In order for Scott to be considered the definitive no. 1, the Efren following may need to see a convincing win (4 or 5 games).

On the other hand, if you are in the Frost camp, a win by any margin will only cement the trend of other recent victories.

I hate to even attempt to call this match but if I gotta'......my prediction is going to be........ hilla-hilla......Frost.;)

Whaddy'all think?

Bernie.
 

WillieNilly

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When i see these 2 match up for the third time i just gota wonder , wats in it for both of them. What is the driving force.

Efren is efren, world reknown and totaly respected as a person and a pool player amongst his peers for the better part of 20 somthin years now. Has done and won everything there is to do in the game. (as far as i know)
So...is it the money?...im sure he likes money, definetally not a financial make or break for him, maybe getting staked anyway.
Revenge on his 2 earlier losses to scott?.
I just dont beleive efren has a vengefull or resentfull bone in his body.he is as humble as the day is long. He still likes to win and play but In place of revenge i believe is a wanting to do it for the people...his people..Us...fans.
He may somday feel the temptation of wanting to prove to himself and others that he still has "it". Besides being totaly uneccesary ... i dont see this happening for a long time if ever.

Scott since they first played has gotten even better , maybe as a result of winning against the "best " in the world and now put in the top 5 1pkt players active today, his confidence has to be thru the roof.
He has won before, he can win again, he likes a challenge.
I have seen him play very non chalonte against weaker players like he doesnt care....win or loose. its just doesnt seem to excite him.
To get the best out of scott it has to be a prestigeous title (derby..ect)or match against a champion in his field of expertise for very high dollar action.
scott is a feared and respected champion 1pocketeer and a good guy from what i can surmise, ive never met him....but i have met efren.

Scott is playing for himself IMHO ,i think he thinks he still has to prove to himself that he is the best today.And he loves Cash.
efren is playing for Us.

regardless of the outcome, This will always be a match that people will talk about for years to come....especially if Efren wins ;)
 

One Pocket Ghost

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bernie p said:
This is going to be an epic match, no doubt. Perhaps the one pocket match of the decade?

There are certainly many who would (arguably) say that Frost and Reyes are currently the two best 1P players in the world today. I believe, as it stands today, it is truly a coin flip.

Efren at age 56 is currently giving up approx 30 years on the wire and yet his recent successes in last couple of years seem to defy the theory that very few major titles are attained in today's billiard arena for the "over 40".

Up until as recently as 2 or 3 years ago Scott had not beaten Efren, even with a couple of ball handicap. Within the last 2 years, I believe Scott has beaten Efren 3 out of 4 times, playing even, for the cash (please correct me if I am wrong).

So psychologically, you could argue that Scott's game has come of age and mentally he is, no doubt, ready. Scott's as the reigning DCC 1P Champion returns to the Derby as the man to beat.

At 56, Efren knows that his 1P reign must come to an end in the foreseeable future but I am not yet quite convinced that we are there today. You might argue that the results of previous short race battles are somewhat inconclusive as to who actually is the "best". Yes, a race to 11 is perhaps more telling but unless the score is a landslide, then a one or two rack difference is essentially of little consequence, beyond bragging rights.

From a "strengths" point of view the differences are very minor and subtle. I believe that Efren has a slight advantage in the early-game moving/tickying area but his eyes are not as young, and his long range "gotta" shoot at shots are perhaps 1 or 2 percent less accurate than the Efren of a few years ago. Both run balls with amazing skill but for the first time ever I believe that Scott is dissecting the pack and manufacturing balls better than Efren. (I know....I know, that's a brazen statement:eek: )

In recent years many Frost detractors have argued that he shoots too aggressively and would eventually succumb to Efren's moving skills however I have personally witnessed a certain level of maturing in Scott's game within the last 18 months, to the point that I feel his current blend of offense/defense to be optimal for modern day 1P Champion standards.

I suspect Efren will be in serious practice with some very skilled competition prior to the match. I believe Scott's biggest challenge will be the lack of tough sparring partners to make him battle ready. Having said that, I have seen Scott with virtually no table time in many weeks, step up and play world class within a few hours. In my book, that is truly the definition of talent/legend.

So....my fellow 1P prognosticators.....what does this all mean? Well.....if you are still a staunch Efren fan, then an Efren win by any score, would solidify his no.1 ranking.
A narrow win (1 or 2 games) by Scott may not totally sway the old Efren Guard.
In order for Scott to be considered the definitive no. 1, the Efren following may need to see a convincing win (4 or 5 games).

On the other hand, if you are in the Frost camp, a win by any margin will only cement the trend of other recent victories.

I hate to even attempt to call this match but if I gotta'......my prediction is going to be........ hilla-hilla......Frost.;)

Whaddy'all think?

Bernie.


Bern.....I agree with both yours and Billy's analysis of both players, and that the match is pretty much a 'pick-it'...

I can't decide who I think will win, so I'm only going to make a score prediction...

My prediction is that the final score will be 11-9 - somebody breaking someone's serve one of the games will stop it from ending up hill-hill.

- Gho$t
 

Fast Lenny

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I would like to give my theory on "why" they are playing and what is in it for them. I believe they both enjoy playing one another as Scott has chased Efren all over. Scott still says Efren is the best and Efren said that Scott is the best now. I am sure Efren feels he can still win and cannot turn down playing anyone in the world even one pocket and Scott certainly will not either after being victorious over Efren.

Efren has lost the past couple of times and not many people have really been swayed, the rail will be heavy betting both ways. IMO Scott is the only one who really has something to lose and to gain in this match because if he loses its I told you so and if he wins then people will say Efren is old and not give Scott his due and just say Efren is old. So maybe its a lose/lose besides the money but Scott wants to beat Efren more then he wants the money, he is not playing Dippy here. I like how people talk about Efren not being able to play/shoot as well, he is winning 9 ball tournaments which is a shooters game, he won the all around once again!

I just think people find it hard to accept but Frost IMO runs balls better than anyone in the game of one pocket which makes you think he cannot move but his moving is very underrated, he is just not one to dink balls around all day like its done at the senior center, no offense to those who do that but its a different game today. Take my words with a grain of salt because I am just a B player hack looking to improve and this is just my opinion. :eek:
 

gulfportdoc

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I hope the match will be played in the Accu-Stats arena, rather than in the action room. If it's in the action room, only a select few will be able to view it.

I'm wondering how many times Scott has to beat Efren before everyone concedes that Scott is the best 1P player of today? The answer probably is that many will never make that concession, irrespective of how many times Scott wins. "Oh, Efren was tired." "Oh, Efren was hung over." "Oh, Efren couldn't get interested in the match." Scott has been the top 1P player since he beat Efren in Phoenix some time ago.

I hope Scott's reign lasts long enough for people to include him in their arguments about who was the best of all time. We definitely need a 3rd contender. The RA/Efren argument has been beaten to death...;)

Doc
 

vapros

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A race to eleven in one-pocket is a lot of pool, and Efren's age has to be a considerable factor. I hope he stands fast in the arrangements and does not let himslef be pushed into a schedule that favors the younger man.

No one can play that long at his very best, and I suspect the match may be decided by who makes the best recovery from a dry spell when his shots are less than his best for a few games. Scott will surely be tested if Efren decides, at some point, to 'let the air out of the ball' for a while. An epic match, to be sure. I hate to miss it, but that's how it is.
 

BUD GREEN

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Could be epic.

Billy, Grady, and Freddie on the mic wouldn't be too bad either.
 

Frank Almanza

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Fast Lenny said:
I believe they both enjoy playing one another as Scott has chased Efren all over.
Didn't Scott put out an offer to play anyone anywhere about a year ago? If I remember correctly Efren's camp accepted the offer and tried to arrange the match in Rancho Cucamonga, Ca. but Scott then wanted the match at Kolbys in Arizona. This coming match should be interesting with two different styles. One power and the other finesse. Like Ruth vs Cobb, Tyson vs Ali. Can't hardly wait.
 
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