Dippy is taken a dip. With the power shooter the Freezer

androd

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petie said:
A friend of mine suggested that all Dave has to do to win is to come out of his stall:eek:)
Yep, the correct game would be about 8/6 :p :D
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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petie said:
I still say he should knock all the ball up table as fast as he can and this will turn the odds in his favor. You take the long run away from Scott. A friend of mine suggested that all Dave has to do to win is to come out of his stall:eek:)

There is no stall. Stall for wha he cant even win what he lost. Yhats good someone stalling himself broke. That makes a loot off sense.

You srall to get the bet up or to get a way bigger spoy. THe bet is as hihg as it can get. And yhe spot hasant been changed hardly at all. Because off how big it is already.

They are playing too win. And both players think they can win or wouldnt be playing. And they are betting higer than winning 10 tournements.


I think that showes that gambling is bigger then tournemets. But not everyone is cut out too do that. And anyone can play in a tournenent because off the price to get in the tournement.

But only a few people can or will play for big money. Thats why I always hustled. Thier is no limite on what you gan bet, But in a tournement its all figured out ahead off time.

And gambling you can Raise the bet 5 or 10 times. And in Hustling or gambling all you need is one good man and you will be set for life.

But its not easy too find one good man. Like a rich wealty billionare who wants too keep playing you because he loves too play.And the money doesnt mean anything too him.

All you have too do is keep playing and raising the bet tell you make the big score. And win as much as you can. You will be set for life.

Or you can play for 20 and 50 dollaers a game for the rest off youre life and never win enough too quite. One big score at aythuing you gamble at can but you on easy street.

And you can loose more mony gambling than anything else I no. It can breack the world. And whatever you may but or do like drinking drugs eating intertainment.

Thier is a limite too realy what you can spend in one day. But not in gambling. Even wars are realy gambling and people have gambled thier country in a war and lost thier countries.

Every day off our life is a gamble. And a price and odds that we will look at the sun and gtass tommarow.

Or will our planet still be her. Lots off people die in the world every day. One off them could be us. Weather its because off health or a accedent.

Thier are many things that can happen. THe unknown. And the bigest gamble thier is. Is our life because when that is gone everything we have we loose. It belongs too someone else.

Gambling has no limits. But like I said its never over tell its over. You pay off when the game is over. Not because you need one gam,e too win the session.

And everyone thinks its over. Things happen in gambling that changes everything. Even sometimes how a person thinks.

Thier are keys and rules and thigs to do to win. And if you dont follow them and you make them for yourself. You can loose everything you have in life.

I have gone through it I no what can happen and what causes it too happen. But I have said enough and tryed too help people my whole life.

And I have payed a very big price for that. I am no lyer because I dont like the feeling I get from lying. Were some people like that feeling. And the live kidding themselves.

I am a realist. And I am for the poor and underdog. Not the rich and the powerfull those people have enough. But to themselves thier will never be enough for them.

And those are the people I like to beat or show the truth about the power. And who is controling everything. But dont look to beat people who have 50 dollaers out off thier last money.

Look for that one big score that I am talking about that will but you on easy street.

That is who you are looking too gamble with. You cant beat someone thats broke allready.

One more thing a broke person will play harder for his last few dollaers then a billionare. One person its everything and his eating money and walk around money or even his few dollars too hustle with.

But too a billionare its intertainment. And loose his money like its a peace off paper witch it is. But too you it has value too him its nothing because he has so much.

Look for one good man and dont ever forget it. And when you think about me allways remember me buy what I have just said,

One big score will change your whole life and mentaly will make you feel great and you will feel like you owne the world.

Because you dont have too think about how to make money every day too live.

It might not make you happy but it sure will help. The say money doesnt make a person happy. Niether does a poor person make him happy being broke.

And if you have a choice too pick out off two equal women who you love who are you going too pick the poor one or the rich one.

You might just pick the poor one because you are a sentamental fool. But its not even close. Look for that big Score.

So ask yourself next time you gamble with someone what can I win. And keep doing that. And you will see what I am saying.

You might never meet that person or get a chance likr that. But at least you no what you should be looking for if you are looking to make a score.

IT is impossable too beat someone that doesnt have anything.

The big SCORE is the name off the game. And what a hustler looks for. And will full fell his dream.

You may look for ever and never find it. But you might look forever and never find your dream girl either.

WINNERS FIND WAS LOOSERS MAKE EXCUSESS. I always wondered how much more we could do and no if we never had too sleep.

Its unblivebale what I think about. But like I said it just pops into my head and I dont no why.

Its just what happines in my mind. And I dont even think about it. It just happines.

And no game is over tell its official. Even if the odds are a billion too one. Thier is still a chance.
 

fred bentivegna

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newfosgatesucks said:
While that sounds good in theory, here is the catch.

There are 15 balls in the rack. IF you can knock TWO OF THEM uptable EVERY SHOT(and that won't happen), then there is a GUARANTEED SEVEN 1/2 INNINGS FOR SCOTT. And you certainly cant be that effective(2 every time). And Scott isn't an idiot- when you give up a major spot you ALREADY know how to not leave a guy down low to shoot them away.

Do you think scott can pull off something spectacular 1 in 3 tries? Yep. You give him 7 tries by wasting innings where something else is more productive in the first place. How many in those 7 tries can he pull something off?

Yes, it is a good idea to let the balls go uptable, but it isn't JUST so easy to get them there. It moves UP for sure on the priority list, but is still beneath safety, aggressive play, GETTING TO THE HILL, and good moving.

And Scott, in case no one has said it, is pretty much the Cream of the crop when it comes to playing an uptable game. IF (with emphasis) you get them there before he pulls something off.


Dip has to fire at his hole as usual, and lay down whitey. Emphasis on layin it down. Every shot-lay it down, lay it down...so interjecting "simply put them up table" does not work - I have played against some VERY strong players, and some professionals myself. When given the chance, you do move them up, but it isn't a matter of "hey, just poke them up table!" Scott has a higher perccentage to make a long straight back that Dippy does to make easier shots. And two-railers, and kicks, And once he sees 3-4 balls go uptable it is Scott's obligation to look for opportunities to prevent/ counteract it. And he CAN!!

And IF you manage to get them uptable in the first 15 innings, I think Scott is WAY favored to lay something down over Dippy. Let's say 5-1?

5 to 1
18 to 4
If Scott is 5 to 1 better than Dip, at an 18 to 4 ratio, then you come up with him scoring 20 to Dippy's 4. Minus one scoring inning, when Dip is at 3, Scott is at 15. So then you have a guy that is 5-1 favorite even up, needing 3-1 odds. in 6 games that equals 5 wins, 1 loss. Multiplied by the 3 to 1 that equals 5 to 3 a winner for Scott. Every cycle of the odds equate to a two game jump for Scott.

I have to be honest. I am not good with math. As much as I have relied on knowledge and systems, I have always approached odds from an instinctive point of view -- unlike Artie and Incardona. I can usually feel it to the point of where things are either good or bad and go from there.

What you say certainly makes sense, but I couldnt verify the math.

I can however, agree with you on the difficulty of Viffer getting the balls uptable in the first place. Scott aint gonna let that happen. The only way that might be possible was if Viffer knew the game better than Scott, and he doesnt.

I watched Ronnie Allen and Fats play, with either guy you could never get the balls up table on them.

When I was playing Efren every day in Chicago, I had a lot of success getting the balls up table with him. I did that not because I enjoyed playing an uptable game, I did it because he hated it much more than I did. Efren does not live having his run outs confounded. But the difference there was that I knew the game better than him at that time.

Realistically, does it make any sense at all that a guy getting 18 to 4 can control the tempo of the game?

Beard

One last point. And this plays somewhat into your theory. If the balls are uptable that means that the difficulty of execution rises considerably with the long distances. Viffers chances of scratching or giving up free shots also increases.
 

SJDinPHX

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Here in Phoenix, the guy's have come up with a word for Scott's awesome firepower...As you have heard Bernie refer to it, they call it the "Frost Factor". It can weaken most pretty good player's. (i.e Cliff Joyner)... I have been around a LOT of good player's (and played most of them) ...but I've never seen anyone put together as many 8-10-12 ball run's, as Scott is capable of. Also, do not underestimate his moving skills, most of which are geared to giving up huge weight, and often require a much different strategy, than playing say Gabe Owen, or Sylver head up.

He seems to have an inate ability to not only outmove his opponent, but also outmanuever him in all the little "hustling" moves...However, like most of us, he does have his weaknesses...and you never know when they might rear their ugly head. (how could anyone be stupid enough to let booze or broads, interfere with his pool game [sic]...).:p

I happen to agree with him, in regards to tournament play...they are too structured, (and short) to allow any mistakes (such as, up all night gambling, drinking, bimbo chasing, etc.) Tournaments often do not determine the best player, they just decide who to give the trophy to.

But if you let him get in stroke, and comfortable, he can be almost unbeatable, regardless of the weight he is giving up..(within reason of course)

As I observe Frost's career move forward, I now believe that RA, in his prime, would not have had a chance to win 'EVEN'... I do however believe, RA would have outsmarted him, and got the cash.

Ronnie combined character, comedy, personality, and gamesmanship in a way that Scott will probably never approach....JMHO
 
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NH Steve

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According to what I read, Scott was ahead 9 games going to 10 ahead, but since then, Dippy fought back to even?? Wow.

Artie, or anyone in Vegas have any more news?

Thanks
 

Deeman

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I nearly feel out at DCC when I saw the 18-4 and 15-4 spots thinking how hard that has to be to give up to anyone who can even hold a cue!

Both these guys seem to have more guts and money then sense! :)

It has probably changed then face of one pocket gambling at least in terms of spots that can be outrun!

DeeMan
 

BUD GREEN

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SJD made some great points about the way Frost plays, especially when giving up weight.

Many times, usually when my girlfriend is insisting on watching Jersey Shore or some other crap, I just go to Lenny's site and pick a Frost match to watch.

Scott banks real well, runs a ton of balls, and seems to constantly be improving his back breaking power shots to where he isn't selling out as often. I love the way he doesn't take too long to shoot either. Caudron the billiard genius is the same way...take a look for two seconds, hit it perfect, repeat as necessary.
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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NH Steve said:
According to what I read, Scott was ahead 9 games going to 10 ahead, but since then, Dippy fought back to even?? Wow.

Artie, or anyone in Vegas have any more news?

Thanks
Yes I herd thier resting. And Scott went too Iceland too buy himself a Ice box too go with the frezzer. He has put his cue on Ice.
 

Fatboy

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fred bentivegna said:
When I was playing Efren every day in Chicago, I had a lot of success getting the balls up table with him. I did that not because I enjoyed playing an uptable game, I did it because he hated it much more than I did. Efren does not live having his run outs confounded. But the difference there was that I knew the game better than him at that time.

Realistically, does it make any sense at all that a guy getting 18 to 4 can control the tempo of the game?

Beard

One last point. And this plays somewhat into your theory. If the balls are uptable that means that the difficulty of execution rises considerably with the long distances. Viffers chances of scratching or giving up free shots also increases.

Getting the balls up table is the best way to beat Efren, or slow him down. Your a pretty sharp guy Mr. Beard :)


On that note I havent watched Dip play Scott so I dont know what strategy Dip used, what ever it is-he needs to change it a bit, what he is doing isnt working.

Like in boxing "Styles make fights" I believe the same holds true in one pocket. Putting the balls up table playing Shannon is a real bad plan, he banks to good and will bank 1-2 and lock up the CB until he beats you to the shot again.


I believe that if Dip changed his game plan he might find more success playing Scott, he still might not get there, perhaps he would. But he has to find something that slows Scott down. There has to be something-everyone has a weak part in their game, its Dips job to find it in Scott. I aint knocking Scott at the moment I believe he is the best in the world at 1P and will be for some time to come, years not months.


I'm only 44, but I dont glorify the past by saying Scott will never have the gamesmanship of Ronnie I watched him play in 85, a bit past his best days and yes he does have a different personality. But personalities dont make players. The equipment is so different now, the pockets were 5", cloth was slow. It was a different period in history, no better or worse than now. live for today not in the past. Today is all we have, except faded memories of the past, hell I can remember Monk playing 60 hours one handed beating player after player, but those memories are not accurate 100%, I cant remember who all he played, I remember he won more than he lost and never once didnt have a cigarette lit, he constantly smoked. Thats what i remember best. he was a hell of a great guy and player. But those days are gone, new business-Whos gonna play next? and for how much? thats what counts.


Fatboy
 

gulfportdoc

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I gather that Frost won 3 or 4 sets, and that he ended up with somewhere in the vicinity of 160K. I don't know how close those figures are. I also don't know if anyone besides the participants have that info...:cool:

Doc
 
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Artie Bodendorfer

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gulfportdoc said:
I gather that Frost won 3 or 4 sets, and that he ended up with somewhere in the vicinity of 160K. I don't know how close those figures are. I also don't know if anyone besides the participants have that info...:cool:

Doc
I would say 3 sets. And I think he won enough too take a week off. But after that it might have too be time too play again.

Scott is a world champion at spending money. I dont no what class he is in saying money. I hope he does the wright thing.

But when you are playing good and things go your way. They think it will always be thier.

And they forget the hard and tough times. BUt some away for retierment isnt a bad move. Even if its only a little bit.

Leave it alone and dont ever touch it and it will grow. And when you get old you will appriciate what you did
.
Dont stay young and dumb and full off come.

But Scott will live his life style I do not see it changing in the near future.

He still hasant filled his oats.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Artie Bodendorfer said:
But Scott will live his life style I do not see it changing in the near future.
Losers always find a way to lose, if not today in the poolroom then tomorrow in the casino.

Dennis
 

Cary

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Losers always find a way to lose, if not today in the poolroom then tomorrow in the casino.

Dennis
We all lose in the end. Nobody gets out alive.
 
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