B. Incardona vs. S. Smith 1998 W.O.P.#3

Cowboy Dennis

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Cowboy Dennis said:
The 12 comes off the rail, makes the 9 and then hits the 3. The cueball stays behind the 11 ball.

P.S. Bill, you showed me something with this shot but your next shot is even better;) .
Due to overwhelming response in my p.m. box, voicemails flooding my cellphone and my mailbox on the street having hundreds of mailed requests in it all begging me to show the next couple of shots, I will:D .

Smith shoots the 8 and puts our hero in a real bad spot:

Smith's Shot.jpg

Warning: This pic is extremely deceiving (it's the only pic)!!!:eek: You MUST be able to picture the balls as they actually are on the table. Have fun with BI's next shot choice. What would you do?

BI's Leave.jpg
 

lll

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smith didnt see the stripe is dead to billys pocket:eek: :rolleyes:
 

senor

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Due to overwhelming response in my p.m. box, voicemails flooding my cellphone and my mailbox on the street having hundreds of mailed requests in it all begging me to show the next couple of shots, I will:D .

Smith shoots the 8 and puts our hero in a real bad spot:

View attachment 2813

Warning: This pic is extremely deceiving (it's the only pic)!!!:eek: You MUST be able to picture the balls as they actually are on the table. Have fun with BI's next shot choice. What would you do?

View attachment 2812
Looks to me that the only balls that Billy can "see" or consider shooting at are the 2 and 3 balls. Maybe slow roll at the 3 to try to play between the rail and the 11, but that is not the shot I would choose because of the speed you have to hit the shot with and the distance of the shot. The shot that looks like it might work is shoot of the 2, cue ball caroms into the 6, then cue ball caroms into the 8, then heads toward the 3 ball or the ball frozen to the bottom rail. I like this shot because it looks like there is room for error between the ball on the bottom rail and the 11 ball. You can also shoot with medium speed and open up some balls.
 

androd

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I'd play thin off the one, hit the 13 ball by his pocket and scratch. :D
Rod.
PS, Or not.
 
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petie

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If the 14 isn't blocking, I like for Billy to go off the side rail at lag speed nudging the 11 and falling on the end rail next to the 10. It takes a little touch but nothing Billy can't handle.
 

gulfportdoc

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From here Smith is obviously the favorite. But in this particular layout the balls aren't laying as bad as they could be for Billy.

For one thing the 3 or 11 balls don't look makable from anywhere but from Smith's far side of the table (unless the 3 is able to be caromed off of the stripe on the rail). The obvious shot is to roll thin off the 1 and on down to, or behind, the 11. But of course Smith then could put Billy right back into the same position.

If there's enough room behind the 1, it might be good to kick behind the 1, rolling the CB down behind the 11, while knocking the 1 over to Billy's side. This would prevent Smith from leaving Billy up table again.

He also might be able to slow roll the 10-15 combo, placing the 15 by his hole. He'd probably end up not leaving Smith a makable ball, then Smith would have to deal with the 15.

He could bank the 1 into the stack with draw. The 14 banks cross-corner, but I believe there's a kiss.

There are lots of options. But if none of them look good, he could always thin off the 1.

Doc
 

wincardona

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Due to overwhelming response in my p.m. box, voicemails flooding my cellphone and my mailbox on the street having hundreds of mailed requests in it all begging me to show the next couple of shots, I will:D .

Smith shoots the 8 and puts our hero in a real bad spot:

View attachment 2813

Warning: This pic is extremely deceiving (it's the only pic)!!!:eek: You MUST be able to picture the balls as they actually are on the table. Have fun with BI's next shot choice. What would you do?

View attachment 2812
This is a pretty tough spot i'm in, lizard lagged the cue ball perfectly and froze me to the cushion. I don't remember what I did, but from looking at this position I would love to take a scratch but there's none available. From the picture anything off the 1 ball seems too risky, but if the biliiard hitting the 1 ball and sending the cue ball into the side of the 13 ball is laying good that would be an option I would consider. I can't kick to the bottom cushion the 11 ball precludes me from doing that. Lets look at the 3 and 11 balls, I might be able to shoot across the 3 ball and nudge the 11 ball away, or even slightly touch the 11 ball and end up near the stripe on the foot rail. The 10 ball to the left of the spot offers me the same type of shot. I could strike the right side of the 10 ball and drop behind the 3 and 11 balls and possibly improve on my position. And then finally there's the 14 ball:eek: I could possibly shoot the 14 ball and follow the cue ball straight to the side rail and drop nicely on the bottom cushion. That shot would take a super accurate hit, but I see a lot of good things happening with that shot. But that's a type of shot that's hard to pull the trigger on. I really can't see any other balls I can shoot off of so what shot would offer me the most natural hit?The type of a hit that is somewhat simple and I can buy some time with and possibly the next time I come back to the table i'll have something better to shoot That would have to be the 10 ball. So if I were shooting this shot today from my computer I would shoot off the 10 ball and drop behind the 3 and 11 balls and hope the next time back at the table I will have a better situation to deal from.:cool:

Stop I could lag the cue ball toward the 12 and 15 balls favoring the 2 ball side with the lag, and hope that my opponent leaves me a better situation to deal with. That thought is a good one and one I should have considered.

Sharing a little wisdom< There are going to be times when you don't know what to do, or you do know what you can do but it may not be that great, it's times like that that we would like to buy some time, so choose a relatively safe shot that will buy some time and allow your opponent back at the table to possibly do something he'll regret or you'll like better than what your looking at.

Billy I.
 
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Artie Bodendorfer

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gulfportdoc said:
From here Smith is obviously the favorite. But in this particular layout the balls aren't laying as bad as they could be for Billy.

For one thing the 3 or 11 balls don't look makable from anywhere but from Smith's far side of the table (unless the 3 is able to be caromed off of the stripe on the rail). The obvious shot is to roll thin off the 1 and on down to, or behind, the 11. But of course Smith then could put Billy right back into the same position.

If there's enough room behind the 1, it might be good to kick behind the 1, rolling the CB down behind the 11, while knocking the 1 over to Billy's side. This would prevent Smith from leaving Billy up table again.

He also might be able to slow roll the 10-15 combo, placing the 15 by his hole. He'd probably end up not leaving Smith a makable ball, then Smith would have to deal with the 15.

He could bank the 1 into the stack with draw. The 14 banks cross-corner, but I believe there's a kiss.

There are lots of options. But if none of them look good, he could always thin off the 1.

Doc
You eithrt kick at the strioe ball easy and he cant do much but seend you up the table.

Or I like this shot a little bit too role the cue ball up too the three balls and take a scratch.

And he wiii cut the ball thin and put you back in the stack. And you will have a different position too manover from.

And the only way you can see it is too play it out. Ans I like it because Snith is on the first scratch.

But kicking at the fstripe ball is the best choice that I see. And one thing for everyone too remember.

Smith is not a ordenary player. He will not give you the chances another player will give you.

You have too keep this in mind. He is a mover more then even a squizzer. Withch people think are the same. But its night and day.

If Anyone ever wants too take up the chalange for the 30 thousand dollaers then I would reveal the real story behind the game.

And the vidio will go down in history and it will be worth a fortune. And what both players will show and put down.

And I will make a copy off what I wrote and I will give it too my children too have and too keep.

And they can sell it or give it too who they think will show why nobody could have won playing 5 games ahead.

PLaying correct one pocket mistake free and how too play ithe game off one pocket correctly.

And it is a combination off all parts off the game. Offense Deffense and agressive play.

And more important controling the hole game. Is thier such a thing as controling the whole game 99% off the people say no. One percent says yes.

That is the real qouistion. WE no thier were meny great players.

And on any given day one could beat the other according how the shot and the balls roled.

Did anyoff those players play the game the way it should be played. Or did they play what they nowe. But never realy figured it out?

But I would kisck at the stripe ball and the balls will slowly start too open up were I can manouver from.

The balls are not in Billys favor But the are not laying real good for Smith.


Her is another important factor. I gave one about a week ago the only person thatb seen it was Freddy it was a very important factor.

And nobody seen it. But Freddy You dont see that I but things out thier too see what people say too what I wright.

I can see by thier answeres if the got it or not.

Her is another one when you are in serious trouble. People look too shoot thier way out. I say look too think your way out.

You only need a little opening too get out off a trap. And the wrong shot or choice by youre opponent will will give you that little day light you need.

Thats why you have too learn too think. Not just shoot.
 

wincardona

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Artie Bodendorfer said:
I dont no what your qouistion is. What is your qouistion. I would be happy to answer youre qouistion?
I believe he's trying to say that he doesn't think that the lizard is on the first foul.

But I like your shot on kicking softly into the 11 ball, and also lagging into the line of balls near the foot spot.

Do whatever you need to do in terms of taking an intentional, or lagging on balls just to buy time and work your way out of this jam.
But if you have something simple to do you don't need to take the intentional, you figure to always be able to take an intentional later if needed.

Billy I.
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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wincardona said:
I believe he's trying to say that he doesn't think that the lizard is on the first foul.

But I like your shot on kicking softly into the 11 ball, and also lagging into the line of balls near the foot spot.

Do whatever you need to do in terms of taking an intentional, or lagging on balls just to buy time and work your way out of this jam.
But if you have something simple to do you don't need to take the intentional, you figure to always be able to take an intentional later if needed.

Billy I.
If Billy is on a foul the second choice is not a option. I kick at the stripe ball and steve will put me back down the end rail.

And we will be going back and fourth tell I get a shot too clear the balls.

Steve will not let you out off the trap because he knowes what you have too do.

So you have too out smart him tell you get a shoot too get out off the trap.

Witch is harder too do against a smart player. Think youre way out. Dont shoot your way out.
 

wincardona

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Artie Bodendorfer said:
If Billy is on a foul the second choice is not a option. I kick at the stripe ball and steve will put me back down the end rail.

And we will be going back and fourth tell I get a shot too clear the balls.

Steve will not let you out off the trap because he knowes what you have too do.

So you have too out smart him tell you get a shoot too get out off the trap.

Witch is harder too do against a smart player. Think youre way out. Dont shoot your way out.
Artie, no one is on a scratch, so I would assume that both options are still good shots. Either kicking softly into the 11 ball, or lagging softly into the balls by the foot spot.

Sometimes the way the balls look in the picture is not the way they look to the players. Maybe I saw something that we could not see from the picture. Lets wait and see what I did, I don't remember.


Billy I.
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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wincardona said:
Artie, no one is on a scratch, so I would assume that both options are still good shots. Either kicking softly into the 11 ball, or lagging softly into the balls by the foot spot.

Sometimes the way the balls look in the picture is not the way they look to the players. Maybe I saw something that we could not see from the picture. Lets wait and see what I did, I don't remember.


Billy I.
I see he went off the eight ball. to get thier. Thier is another shot nowe off the 10 ball behind the two balls.

But I would say the kick shot is pretty obvious. And I would say that is what you shot.

I dont see the Dvd so we wont no tell its shown.
 

lll

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softly to avoid the scratch i like this ( i havent read thru all the posts:eek: )
cb1.jpg
 

petie

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lll said:
softly to avoid the scratch i like this ( i havent read thru all the posts:eek: )
View attachment 2814
This is my shot from post #25 exept I don't go off the 14. I asume you are going off the 14 because your cue ball arrows change direction subtly after the 14. Also, I do agree with AB that hitting the 11 fuller is more fool proof. It sure seems to put Steve in a bad spot. What a reversal of fortune. A long time ago in another thread about this same game when we were saying what we thought Steve would do before the last shot, I said he would come off the one ball and put Billy on the end rail on Steve's side of the table. Well, he went off the 8 but ended up in the same place I said. Right after I posted it but had moved mysef away from the computer (I'm on crutches following ankle surgery and moving from room to room is a big deal), I thought of a better move for Steve.

Come off the one ball, hit the end rail and come up half way on the right hand side rail. This would have put Billy in a world of hurt. The way it stands now, I like Billy's chances for the win. With the move I just stated, it would have been Steve's game. What'y'a think?
 
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lll

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petie said:
This is my shot from post #25 exept I don't go off the 14. I asume you are going off the 14 because your cue ball arrows change direction subtly after the 14. Also, I do agree with AB that hitting the 11 fuller is more fool proof. It sure seems to put Steve in a bad spot. What a reversal of fortune. A long time ago in another thread about this same game when we were saying what we thought Steve would do before the last shot, I said he would come off the one ball and put Billy on the end rail on Steve's side of the table. Well, he went off the 8 but ended up in the same place I said. Right after I posted it but had moved mysef away from the computer (I'm on crutches following ankle surgery and moving from room to room is a big deal), I thought of a better move for Steve.

Come off the one ball, hit the end rail and come up half way on the right hand side rail. This would have put Billy in a world of hurt. The way it stands now, I like Billy's chances for the win. With the move I just stated, it would have been Steve's game. What'y'a think?
petie
my arrows are sometimes shaky .my shot did not carum off the 14.
the fact that we saw the same shot im not sure we should brag about:D (jk)

if you left him higher on the long rail instedad of near the pocket the intentional options still exist and the one rail kick to smiths corner is still makeable.jmho
 

petie

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We can't be all that bad at least in this case. After all, Artie agreed with us. Going off the one to the end rail or farther up on the side rail may be Steve's next move here.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Warning: This pic is extremely deceiving (it's the only pic)!!!:eek: You MUST be able to picture the balls as they actually are on the table. Have fun with BI's next shot choice. What would you do?
This disclaimer was issued for a reason:p . It wasn't fair to expect anybody to see the shot that BI chose. The Greenshot diagram of mine doesn't do the shot justice, he hit it great and had the foresight to hit it with top right also. He force-followed from the end rail and controlled the rock.

This shot and his previous shot (post #17) are worth the price of the DVD.(To my critics: how often do I say that?)

I did not show the movement of all the balls but where they ended up.



Bill's Shot.jpg

Here's how he left it:

CapturedPicture_12.Jpeg

CapturedPicture_11.Jpeg
 
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