john v ghost

[fred bentivegna]

The Ghost gave it a good effort, but he just seemed to run out of gas at the end. I personally didnt think he should have stopped to eat, even tho John did the same. When I was playing long sets, "eating" consisted of coffee with sugar and a chocolate bar or a bag of peanuts.

My sincere congrats go out to an old warrior, John Henderson. He is one tough old, mean son of a bitch!

Anybody trying to learn how to play in big games and pressure situations should carefully study John's demeanor in this last match. 23 hours and no ups and downs in his emotions. One unbroken line of concentration almost all the way thru the whole thing. He just went about his business every game and every shot.

You might beat him but you will never "out gruel" him, even Artie found that out.

Beard

(Personal to John: the above compliments have nothing to do with that nice "jelly" you laid on me.)

 

[Tom Wirth]

I'm certain I watched at least one game where Ghost ran eight and out. No question about it.

John and Ghost; excellent effort from both of you, and thank you for stepping up to the plate and having your match streamed. A noble gesture and one which applies pressure to anyone who agrees to play under those circumstances.

Tom

 

[DWS]

My 2 cents

My 2 cents

I think they both played a great match. Both shot well and moved well. Both got a couple rolls here and there. Both missed shots that they should have never missed. Congratulations to John....he is definately a hardcore stand up warrior with no give up in him........I sweated the Artie match and they both outlasted me..........that was brutal.....he was able to capitalize when necessary. The Ghost as welll.....everyone talks about Johns age (granted...thats impressive).....The Ghost ain't no spring chicken either (no offense) and he fought as hard in my opinion but for anyone to say the Ghost wasn't playing great as well wasn't watching the same match I was. He had the thing won when it was 9-7 and decided to cut an object ball just off the head rail near Johns pocket.....it jawed and popped out....cue back went down to foot rail and back up leaving John a straight in and able to get behind his game ball and several other times when the ball just didn't fall and was left in the jaws after difficult banks and was left one the jaws.....one more inch and Ghost wins......that happened at least 3 times......but they both played great all the way to the wire.......Freddy may be right aboug the food thing....I dont know.....But to say anyone game was better......I just dont see it......Both missed a bunch of shots they normally would make.......both took a stab at some questionable shots where probably should have played safe.......but who doesn't do that?......but Im not the one at the table.....so who am I to say or anyone else for that matter......shit happens and thats the way it goes....It was well worth it to watch and had some of those normally made shots been made.....we would probably have a different outcome.......Congrats again John.......and great job Ghost!!!!! Thanks for the match
Just my 2 cents

PS......thanks to the 2 Johns.....owners of Red Shoes
PPS......See San Jose Dick observation post in members cafe.....

 

[FastEddieF.]

Great Match

Great Match

I watched some of the games and the difference seemed like the ghost was always under pressure and John was just playing without pressure. Money does have something to do about it. MIO

 

[RedCard]

Thanks

Thanks

Congratulations to both players. I watched it off and on all weekend. Thanks to everyone involved for the show.

Last night during the final game I went to the kitchen and poured myself a shot of ZzzQuil and spilled it on the counter top. I felt sure the Ghost was going to get that last game after seeing the ZzzQuil on the counter form up. I took the attached picture of the resulting non-mess. I'm sure the little med cup on the counter had something to do with the shape but then again... pool often seems controlled by strange and unseen forces.

John is stronger than ZzzQuil.

 

[petie]

Congratulations to both players. I watched it off and on all weekend. Thanks to everyone involved for the show.

Last night during the final game I went to the kitchen and poured myself a shot of ZzzQuil and spilled it on the counter top. I felt sure the Ghost was going to get that last game after seeing the ZzzQuil on the counter form up. I took the attached picture of the resulting non-mess. I'm sure the little med cup on the counter had something to do with the shape but then again... pool often seems controlled by strange and unseen forces.

John is stronger than ZzzQuil.

This reminds me of being down in Miami about 50 years ago and coming off the elevator at the Jai Alai Fronton and seeing the exit sign in the mirror. The E looked like a 3 so what player do you think I placed the next bet on? I won but I'm not proud of it.

 

[Don Smith]

I missed the last game after the food break. Is there a replay anywhere?

 

[tucson9ball]

Congrats to both players

I watched quite a bit on day 2 and learned "patience".

I was pulling for John since I have actually met him a couple times. Plus, he mentioned if he won, he may play Bill Stroud in Phoenix. I could drive up and watch that matchup.

Anyhoo, grats again to both players for allowing the match to be streamed and giving us all some good 1 Pocket to watch.


PS..in the chat, I had to type ultra-slow, otherwise some letters would not show up. Not sue if it was my computer or others had this same problem?

 

[RedCard]

'71-2 at the Fronton

'71-2 at the Fronton

This reminds me of being down in Miami about 50 years ago and coming off the elevator at the Jai Alai Fronton and seeing the exit sign in the mirror. The E looked like a 3 so what player do you think I placed the next bet on? I won but I'm not proud of it.

The first of the very few times I went in a Fronton down there I saw the players all sitting on a bench together and resolved not to bet on Jai Alai ever. That resolve was challenged when they sent the bikinied girls with headsets around to take bets and bring beer. I stood strong.

 

[mr3cushion]

About the "Match," John at his age is a strong competitor, He also is a PERFECT gentleman it looks to me in ALL facets of his life. His mental game is MUCH stronger than the Ghost. Both players had issues pocketing balls, I'm not sure but, I don't think either player ever ran 4 balls the entire time, (which was quite long). From what I could tell, the Ghost has a better game after the break, but, could not take advantage, could not run balls when he had an advantage. John has a better end game, and ALL the games, because NO ball running, were end game scenarios.

Do I think both players played their REAL speed, maybe. There's $20 speed,$100 speed and we ALL saw $3000 speed for these 2 players. I'm sure both players were a little nervous the 1st day, I thought they would snap out of by the next. Unfortunately for them their game's never seemed to kick in. And yesterdays finish was pretty much the same as the previous days, maybe a little less!

You are talking about a guy who is well into his seventies. An old man who had a seven hour flight to a different time zone and then you talk about his $3000 dollar speed? Johns game is about a third of what it used to be. Ten and out was not a rarity for John, it was normal.
When players came to California to play, John was there. On the 6X12 in LA, John was king. After he moved to Northern California, he played everyone, teaching players like me and anyone else who wanted to learn.
We have been going to the DCC for the past few years and John has won a lot of matches. $4K, 3k, 2K . He did lose a partners game but I don't count 3-1 games. (Three players against one.) He played Billy I, but Billy, I have to say played great, and nearly perfect. John was helpless. I know about all these games because they paid for our trips. Then there was the $4K match in AZ.
John plays on his own money. Not a backers money. His own SS money. Tell me that a guy living on retirement doesn't have game. The match could have easily been a $tenK match. John left a big chunk of change on the counter because he knew Ghoast couldn't go for any more.
The only thing I can say about john is what everyone on the best coast knows, HOF HOF HOF
For playing
For teaching,
For being a representative of the game.:lol

Scrzbill; Since you decided to quote me, I'll give you another chance to do so again. First let me say, I have VERY high respect for John as a person and as a "Old Time Warrior" still in the trenches! He deserved to WIN, NO doubt!

As far as YOUR comments, John showed up in Chicago 2-3 days ahead of the match, so NO jet lag issue.

From what I understand, John is somewhere around 72-74 years of age, 4 or 6 years older than me!

John just played a match HERE and NOW 2013, NOT how HE played 15-20 years ago!

They were'nt playing "golf" on a 6'x12' snooker table, this was one pocket on 4.5x9' table!

I hope they didn't teach you in KY that everyone in Chicago does business, MOST of the REAL good thieves I've known for the past 45 years hailed from the, "Blue Grass" state!

I commend John for betting "His Own", or should I say He and "Uncle Sam's!" lol

From My understanding from my good buddy Freddy, the TOTAL action was about 5-6K! So don't ever think Northern Cal was going to "High Roll" Chi-Town!

If they ever have a, "Super Senior" Action award, John is a shoe-in!

I hope I didn't leave any of your valid (NOT) points unanswered, please feel free to correct me.

Once again, I can't express how impressed I am with John Henderson the MAN, GAMBLER and PLAYER!

Hard to believe He hails from Northern Cal.

Of course, these are ONLY MY observations of the facts!

Bill Smith "Mr3Cushion"

 

[spiderwebcomm]

Ghost to shoot right now! with this situation, both needing two balls.

Ghost's pocket at our left as we look at the table from the camera view. I should have labeled it, but was in a rush, lol.

The Ghost had pretty good speed on all of his banks throughout the match. I wonder if he considered double-banking this shot and drawing the CB back above the side for a chance to win the match? If I recall, he thinned this shot and created an opening for John.

The double-bank is almost a free shot to win while mitigating the chances of leaving a sell-out (assuming you zip the CB back). It's pretty easy to control whitey on this since you really can't hit the OB too hard.

If you leave the CB side-high, you have a chance of protecting your OB if you leave it near your hole. If you zip the CB back and get close to that end rail, you can't protect your ball but shooting from there sucks.

If you thin the bottom ball, you have to know you "should" make it. I think he shot it with center and came up and down on the table (I forget, but that's tough). I like using outside and spinning around the table putting the CB back in front of his pocket. I just re-looked at this shot... he may not have had enough room... tough to tell.

Now, all of the above is "armchair quarterbacking" -- just some constructive thoughts on the shot you posted. Everyone's styles differ in this game. Personally, if I thin the bottom ball, I'm shooting it aggressively as mentioned above, based on the score. Otherwise, the 2-railer is a free chance to win.

Your thoughts?

 

[jrhendy]

The Ghost had pretty good speed on all of his banks throughout the match. I wonder if he considered double-banking this shot and drawing the CB back above the side for a chance to win the match? If I recall, he thinned this shot and created an opening for John.

The double-bank is almost a free shot to win while mitigating the chances of leaving a sell-out (assuming you zip the CB back). It's pretty easy to control whitey on this since you really can't hit the OB too hard.

If you leave the CB side-high, you have a chance of protecting your OB if you leave it near your hole. If you zip the CB back and get close to that end rail, you can't protect your ball but shooting from there sucks.

If you thin the bottom ball, you have to know you "should" make it. I think he shot it with center and came up and down on the table (I forget, but that's tough). I like using outside and spinning around the table putting the CB back in front of his pocket. I just re-looked at this shot... he may not have had enough room... tough to tell.

Now, all of the above is "armchair quarterbacking" -- just some constructive thoughts on the shot you posted. Everyone's styles differ in this game. Personally, if I thin the bottom ball, I'm shooting it aggressively as mentioned above, based on the score. Otherwise, the 2-railer is a free chance to win.

Your thoughts?

The two railer is a stiff. This table has Diamond rails and all banks come off short on the 2nd rail. You would have to hit within two or three inches from the pocket on your side to even have a chance of making it.

Very risky where the balls lay.

 

[NH Steve]

The Ghost had pretty good speed on all of his banks throughout the match. I wonder if he considered double-banking this shot and drawing the CB back above the side for a chance to win the match? If I recall, he thinned this shot and created an opening for John.

The double-bank is almost a free shot to win while mitigating the chances of leaving a sell-out (assuming you zip the CB back). It's pretty easy to control whitey on this since you really can't hit the OB too hard.

If you leave the CB side-high, you have a chance of protecting your OB if you leave it near your hole. If you zip the CB back and get close to that end rail, you can't protect your ball but shooting from there sucks.

If you thin the bottom ball, you have to know you "should" make it. I think he shot it with center and came up and down on the table (I forget, but that's tough). I like using outside and spinning around the table putting the CB back in front of his pocket. I just re-looked at this shot... he may not have had enough room... tough to tell.

Now, all of the above is "armchair quarterbacking" -- just some constructive thoughts on the shot you posted. Everyone's styles differ in this game. Personally, if I thin the bottom ball, I'm shooting it aggressively as mentioned above, based on the score. Otherwise, the 2-railer is a free chance to win.

Your thoughts?

The trouble with trying to double bank that ball, is that to play it safe at the same time you have to hit it extra hard, and when you hit that shot extra hard, it is going to straighten out on the second rail 99% of the time, meaning you will not make the bank. You cannot really have it both ways, in my humble opinion. In that case, why play it?

Edit -- what John said, lol -- I guess he was posting at the same time.

 

[suki]

thought it was my computer

thought it was my computer

Congrats to both players

I watched quite a bit on day 2 and learned "patience".

I was pulling for John since I have actually met him a couple times. Plus, he mentioned if he won, he may play Bill Stroud in Phoenix. I could drive up and watch that matchup.

Anyhoo, grats again to both players for allowing the match to be streamed and giving us all some good 1 Pocket to watch.


PS..in the chat, I had to type ultra-slow, otherwise some letters would not show up. Not sue if it was my computer or others had this same problem?

worked fine on my laptop, lousy on my pc. chat was a joke

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

worked fine on my laptop, lousy on my pc. chat was a joke

The chat didn't seem to work correctly. I replied to a question that lll asked and he said my reply came before his question (on his computer). Steve Booth was about two minutes behind the video stream I was watching and commenting on possible shots that happened already. A very strange chat but a great stream and match.

Dennis

 

[Jimmy B]

worked fine on my laptop, lousy on my pc. chat was a joke

It was strange, wasn't it. The new posts appear at the top. I used it a couple of times, but I like it on full screen on the 23 inch monitor and on my pc, when I go to full screen, the chat disappears. What would be the nuts is to have where you could put it on full screen and still have a small chat box at the bottom just like on Full Tilt Poker...

 

[spiderwebcomm]

The two railer is a stiff. This table has Diamond rails and all banks come off short on the 2nd rail. You would have to hit within two or three inches from the pocket on your side to even have a chance of making it.

Very risky where the balls lay.

Just for my one pocket education, could you expand how that shot could be risky compared to the opted play?

Thanks (Trying to learn here)--

Dave

 

[jrhendy]

Just for my one pocket education, could you expand how that shot could be risky compared to the opted play?

Thanks (Trying to learn here)--

Dave

By drawing the cue ball uptable, he is at least going to leave me a bank on the ball on the spot. It is doubtful he could bank that ball pocket speed two rails and it would not get close enough to the pocket if he hit it perfect IMO.

He was much more familiar with this table than I, he likes to bank and still chose another shot.

 

[One Pocket Ghost]

The two railer is a stiff.

Very risky where the balls lay.

What John said here is correct...I looked at it for a second, then dismissed it...and I'm saying this, as being a guy who loves multi-rail banks, is always looking for them, and hit's them pretty good.

- Ghost

PS, I'll talk about the cut shot I chose, at a later time.

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

Justlike in tennis, the serve is a big advantage. The opposing player has to break serve at least once to win.

It's the same in one pocket, if you can't win on the other guys' break,at least once, then you just can't win.

In One-Pocket, the opposing player has to break "serve" once to win only if he lost the lag or toss for the 1st break.

In tennis, you do not have to "break" serve in a game to win. You can have a "mini-break" in a tiebreaker and win without ever having to "break" the opponents serve in a game. Only in the 5th set at Wimbledon do you have to break serve to win a tied set.

The serve in tennis is not completely analogous to the break in One-Pocket. The serve in tennis is much more powerful than the break in One-Pocket. How often do you see any player not getting out of an opponents break? Not often.

Dennis