Alex/shannon make it happen #1

Jimmy B

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Aug 17, 2007
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Jersey Red taught me how to aim them. My percentage went way up after that.
Rod.

I'm not surprised he taught you things. Lots of players mention how he did that and how much he worked on his game and how much he practiced. Even in the latest interview that Steve just put up, Norman 'The Jockey' Howard mentioned how much he loved to play as well as practice and help others as well. That was way back when The Jockey was in NY. He caught a bus then a subway to go to The 7-11 and 50th street, but he knew him from Jersey City also. Good interview but he didn't stay on track to good. I liked when he wrecked Clem Metz car and had to pay the deductable. I learn from all the different selections no matter what I would shoot. Didn't Dr. Bill do these matches. What did he say??



Norman Howard aka Jockey
 

SJDinPHX

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SJD,
It seems as though the only ego bruised happens to be yours seeing that you are the only one complaining and denigrating. Could it be that maybe it is you who are taking it all too personally?

BTW... you are not the only one who frequents this site. There are many who wish to learn shots which may not be new to you but may be very new to others. Feel free to ignore all post containing information which you already possess, but please keep in mind there are several who we never hear from who are eager to learn. It is for their benefit that I and others provide our thoughts and input. I certainly have continually benefitted from the ideas of others on this site. I learned a long time ago that a good teacher can and should also find ways to learn from his students.

Here, we are all both teacher and student.

Tom

You may be right Tom !..I am extremely frustrated that I can no longer play AT ALL !... Or back up my insights with my cash !..You seem like a fair minded sort, and I can accept YOUR criticism !...You make a good point about those who come here to learn !..Let me just say, that my bitter antagonists, and I, go way back, and they, (like me) have left no stone unturned, if a chance to insult or belittle, arises !...I'm sure you have noticed both sides of that !

I'm glad you enjoy teaching and learning...I'm sure you and I could have had a decent exchange of viewpoints, as I have had with MOST of the other good player's ! ...But, as I said in my last post, I am bowing out of the WWYD,s..I guess I have gotten too old and cranky, to have much tolerance (make that zero) for my old foes !...And, I do apologize (TO YOU) for that...I just hope I last long enough, to see how THEY react, when they reach 'Super Senior' status !...I'm sorry, but 'brown-nosing', and 'piling on', have always been two of my worst game's !

Respectfully,

SJD

PS..Now, I'll lay pretty good odds, I will get the, "poor me,I'm the victim" shot, from at LEAST one of them !
 
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Tom Wirth

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Dick, Thank you for accepting my criticism for some of your comments. It take a lot to admit ones faults as you have done here. Nothing personal you know. :) Dick, None of us are too old to learn to make beneficial changes to our behavior. Maybe if you lead the way others will follow. Someone has to begin the healing. You obviously are not a happy person and for someone your age don't you think you deserve a little happiness.

We all get caught up in controversies once in a while but to allow them to continue indefinitely isn't the answer. These wars you are engaged in aren't doing you or anyone else any good. They throw a punch, you throw one right back. No one wins. Let it all go and maybe they will too. If they choose to continue the wars; well then you are the bigger man.

Dick I could just as easily be saying this to the others engaged in all this silliness.

Good luck,

Tom
 

mr3cushion

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Dick, Thank you for accepting my criticism for some of your comments. It take a lot to admit ones faults as you have done here. Nothing personal you know. :) Dick, None of us are too old to learn to make beneficial changes to our behavior. Maybe if you lead the way others will follow. Someone has to begin the healing. You obviously are not a happy person and for someone your age don't you think you deserve a little happiness.

We all get caught up in controversies once in a while but to allow them to continue indefinitely isn't the answer. These wars you are engaged in aren't doing you or anyone else any good. They throw a punch, you throw one right back. No one wins. Let it all go and maybe they will too. If they choose to continue the wars; well then you are the bigger man.

Dick I could just as easily be saying this to the others engaged in all this silliness.

Good luck,

Tom

Tom; Just like I told our fearless leader, it would be just a matter of time before,"Mr. Hyde" :eek: would start out as a tart topping to ruin the taste of every ones favorite flavor of ice cream, and then...!

When I get to be a "Senior" citizen, (which is in a couple of years), I surly won't impose my bitterness about it on every one else if I can't play anymore, but I doubt if that will be the case! :cool:

Bill Smith "Mr3Cushion"
 
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lll

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Dick you sound like a 9-baller here. It was a good simple shot that One Pocket players should get to know, and knowing the shot, Alex knew where his cue ball was going. Furthermore, you are forgetting that Alex was in deep trouble and needed to do something -- with all the balls already on Shannon's side, following his great break. Even if Alex only gets a couple balls -- because he happened to end up too straight on the 10 -- he gets to remove Shannon's hanger and live to battle out the rest of the game.

What would you have done instead in Alex's shoes since you either didn't see or didn't like the carom/billiard?

The difference is, you did not say what you would do or give a single reason for anything in your first post except to belittle the Ghost. All those other players you call "nine-ballers" made suggestions and did give their reasons. Even when I nudged you to say what you would have done instead, you still did not commit to what you would have shot.

Also, in your second post, I beg to differ -- the carom/billiard was not what moved all the balls to Shannon's side -- that was the result of Shannon's great break, which was why Alex needed to come up with something creative in the first place. And guess what, Alex's shot just happened to be the Ghost's shot. You're just lucky Alex didn't run all the way out!

The thing that is wrong about your first post, and that I would like to see disappear from these WWYD threads completely, is the belittling/mocking without even making a suggestion of your own. I takes a little guts to suggest a shot here, because there are a lot of really seasoned players here on OnePocket.org that know their stuff and they *might* disagree with you. However, anyone can belittle and criticize but all that does is discourage people from participating, while it stirs up trouble.

steve
you shoud be called king solomon:)
dick you from the past i give you ALOT of the benefit of the doubt
but in the near present i havent approved of your behavior
read what steve is saying
to be continued
 

lll

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Piggy, I don't think your shot is any good because of the bank on the one. And with a traffic cop to help direct the one, that bank can hardly be missed if hit at all well. Better think of something else.

BP, Same thing happens with your shot. That bank on the one becomes a hanger if you leave the cue ball on the side rail. So whether you use the nine to do that or slide off the deuce, the bank still begs to be shot. Drawing off the one to the side rail is way too tough for me but some here might be able to pull off that shot. I already know I would loose whitey and sell out.

Bernie, Your shot has merit if you can pull it off but it looks to me from the overhead angle the shot isn't there.

Now that I've had the audacity to criticize all your options...

I'm not all that opposed to that carom shot on the six as The Ghost suggested. From the pictures it is still hard to tell if it is laying right though. Any strictly defensive attempt other than taking a foul in this situation is just as difficult as that carom. In addition, the likelihood of having a second shot is very high shooting the carom. And if I'm going down, I'm going down shooting for a win.

Tom

this post critized several shot selections
it wasnt personal
just business ..:)
 

tylerdurden

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With all due respect to the Hacker, who’s One Pocket game is obviously very solid…

...brilliant Tyler, really?…why in the world would you call a simple response like that, that any average One Pocket would see and consider, brilliant..:confused:…here are some results/responses to that choice…

…first of all, the stun-shot is not hanger-execution - you are close to the rail - you’ll have to jack up and stun it - end up too high, Shannon cuts the 9, end up too low, he banks the 2...and as for Hacker’s second option with the 1ball, lagging it/leaving it by the side pocket…if you did that to me, I’ll just come off of that 1ball and leave you frozen in the center of the head rail, doubling you up on the 9 and 11balls - now you’re in a worse trap from there.

- Ghost

I guess brilliant, being too strong a word for sure, was just referring to the fact that he knows you don't have to practically throw in the towel here. If this game was being played for 50k, and you had 50 top players come in and play the billiard from here, and another 50 shoot hacker's simple shot, I think the results would surprise you guys (considering the responses in this thread). I think there is way too much assuming the game is over if the billiard is not played. That's all.

The last thing I want to do here in a very serious spot is miss and leave the 11 hanging, and a total gimme runout. For the mentioned 50k it would be like the easiest runout you could ever give up. You are going to open up every ball. The more play there is in this game, the more those balls will PROBABLY favor alex (right now not much goes for him). Day in day out, and especially for big money, I don't like the billiard here, and I have shot and practiced them. I like grinding and playing solid one hole and letting him know he will have to earn all 8, and not at once. That's it. No need to discuss and pontificate this. Some like it, some don't, but no need to oddly mention how the people who don't like it don't know how to shoot it. It seems to me to be the opposite - the people that don't like it actually do know how fickle and unpredictable of a shot it is, especially in a big spot. That is really it though, no need to defend, just differences of opinion.
 
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One Pocket Ghost

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If this game was being played for 50k, and you had 50 top players come in and play the billiard from here, and another 50 shoot hacker's simple shot, I think the results would surprise you guys

Tyler...

The problem with your statement above is that 50 top players wouldn't choose to shoot the Hacker's shot...did you not read my post? - you chose to ignore the fact that I pointed out the flaws in the shot - showing it to actually be a weak choice, light years away from brilliant...please tell me how you will successfully respond to my leaving you frozen to the middle of the head rail, doubled up on the 9 and the 11, after you shoot the hacker's shot.

- Ghost
 
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tylerdurden

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Tyler...

The problem with your statement above is that 50 top players wouldn't choose to shoot the Hacker's shot...did you not read my post? - you chose to ignore the fact that I pointed out the flaws in the shot - showing it to actually be a weak choice, light years away from brilliant...please tell me how you will successfully respond to my leaving you frozen to the middle of the head rail, doubled up on the 9 and the 11, after you shoot the hacker's shot.

- Ghost

Why don't you diagram your shot and I'll gladly respond. I don't know what ball you are coming off to get up there. We're assuming the one is pocketed on hacker's shot I suppose.

Here is the way I see this game going down, from the start, if anyone cares. Something like rob's shot, then I am stuck on the other side of the stack, at some point the 11 gets kicked in and I have moved that 1 (thank goodness, but the 9 may still be there)..... and play the game from 1 to 0. that wasn't an attempt at a play by play, just an example of how easy it could be 1 to 0 and balls lay favoring nobody. I think something like this is very very possibly what would ensue after a few little shots, and with the added benefit that i bet the balls would lay slightly better for alex, cus they lay so bad now. All I know is I am loving guys shooting that billiard on me. That is the path to the cash with zero need even hardly get out of your chair. I love it when guys do stuff like that, especially on a consistent basis. Really, if you were playing this game for big money, what would you rather see... the guy getting ready to grind grind away, or the guy that is shaking his arm loose to shoot a total flyer and leave you 8 hangers if he misses.
 

lll

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vero beach fl
Find the line where the silhouettes of both balls close and extend it towards the pocket. The ball that you billiard will go there. Add English to taste. :)
Rod.
P.S. These can look off until you gain confidence that the line up is correct.
Rod .thanks for sharing that.:)

keeping with the sharing theme
here is a "system" for the split shot
split shot billiard.jpg
 

fred bentivegna

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Larry, if I get to see you around a pool table again, I will show you how to never miss those "give-up" carom shots from even the most amazing positions, while you could be sitting in a lounge chair! (Along with English, speed, follow, dead-ball carom and draw also influence the making of the carom, and ize noes how to make all dem adjustments)

Beard

The greatest onepocket players that have ever lived have all been "give-up" players (besides Artie, even tho he always knew when to shoot a give-up shot)

The two players I loved shooting give-ups shots on, were Artie and Incardona, because percentage freaks that they were, that always rankled them the most. (Even tho I was "never the favorite to run out" (according to Dr Bill).:eek::confused:
 
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wincardona

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Larry, if I get to see you around a pool table again, I will show you how to never miss those "give-up" carom shots from even the most amazing positions, while you could be sitting in a lounge chair! (Along with English, speed, follow, dead-ball carom and draw also influence the making of the carom, and ize noes how to make all dem adjustments)

Beard

The greatest onepocket players that have ever lived have all been "give-up" players (besides Artie, even tho he always knew when to shoot a give-up shot)

The two players I loved shooting give-ups shots on, were Artie and Incardona, because percentage freaks that they were, that always rankled them the most. (Even tho I was "never the favorite to run out" (according to Dr Bill).:eek::confused:
Yes there are other options available, however, they are lessened because of the position of the 11ball. The 11ball is positioned to where you can never really feel comfortable as long as it's sitting in the position it's in...especially playing a left handed player that has exceptional skills in pocketing balls. By playing off either the 1ball or 9ball you will then leave Shannon on the side of the table where he is most comfortable shooting from, and to do that is only asking for trouble. The two factors that must be evaluated are ..the ability of the player shooting the billiard.. and the ability of his opponent shooting the 11ball if another option is chosen. It doesn't appear that there are any options to stick the cue ball in the stack and move balls, if there were then obviously they would clearly be viable, which would preclude Daulton from shooting the 11ball. Now I would like to go back to where I said that if I were a 3/2 dog or less to make the billiard then I would gamble and shoot it. I'm conceding that shooting the 6ball billiard that you may be the dog to make it, however, that's not a good reason for you ..not to shoot it..simply because if you don't shoot it you are imo more than a 3/2 dog to win the game. More like 2/1 to win the game. (TWO TOP PLAYERS) It's all about understanding your ability as a player and your opponents abilities, and placing a reasonable evaluation on the skill level of both players. Playing a top player i'm shooting the billiard more quickly then if I were playing a player like Freddie The Beard. Not that Freddie can't play which he can, however, he can't execute like a top player so that will give me more latitude in selecting options. Playing Freddie if i'm 3/2 dog to make the billiard I would look elsewhere for the reason that I don't want to hand deliver an opportunity to a player that has a hard time creating opportunities for themselves like top players can. Sorry Fred. Any ways, that's just the way I gamble and maybe others just might find that interesting and noteworthy.

Dr. Bill

Please don't misquote me and say I said something I didn't say. Above in red is what I said, does that sound like I said that you're never the favorite to run out? I remember what you did to me Dec 17th in the year of 1977 :D
 

fred bentivegna

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Please don't misquote me and say I said something I didn't say. Above in red is what I said, does that sound like I said that you're never the favorite to run out? I remember what you did to me Dec 17th in the year of 1977 :D

You didnt out and out say it, but it was certainly implied! Right fellas?


Beard
 

wincardona

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You didnt out and out say it, but it was certainly implied! Right fellas?


Beard

I 'implied' exactly what I stated. Now if we all could go back in time then I would of critiqued someone else, maybe a player like The Ghost. :sorry Waiting for another rebuttal.:rolleyes:

Dr. Bill
 

One Pocket Ghost

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I 'implied' exactly what I stated. Now if we all could go back in time then I would of critiqued someone else, maybe a player like The Ghost. :sorry Waiting for another rebuttal.:rolleyes:

Dr. Bill

..........:heh
 

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backplaying

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I guess one way to look at it, is he went from a big dog in that game, to a big favorite with one shot. As good a break as Shannon put down, Alex would have had to come with many defensive moves to get out of that break. I would bet Shannon was hoping Alex wasn't going to shoot it. I still think Alex should have lost the game after missing the 12 ball. That shot might have been easy for some, but on the rail using any English, especially inside would be a very tough shot for me, and I would have been happy to shoot the 11 ball away from Shannon's hole from there.
 
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