How do you spot owed balls when the table is cleared?

vapros

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If the game is 18-4, and if Viffer makes no balls at all, then Gabe, after knocking down all 15 balls, will spot up the 3 he needs to reach 18 and he will keep shooting. BUT suppose Viffer makes all three of those balls and is still at the table. How many are spotted now? One or three? :eek:
 

androd

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vapros said:
If the game is 18-4, and if Viffer makes no balls at all, then Gabe, after knocking down all 15 balls, will spot up the 3 he needs to reach 18 and he will keep shooting. BUT suppose Viffer makes all three of those balls and is still at the table. How many are spotted now? One or three? :eek:

Gabe would owe 6 balls. spot them all and he needs 3 and Viff needs 4. :D
Rod.
 

SJDinPHX

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treeMan said:
maybe this will help.

Gabe owes those balls before the game starts. There is no other way to go to 18. There is no such thing as "additional balls that are needed to complete the game".

Think of 18-4 as 12-4 AND the player going to 12 starts out "owing" 6 balls. That is what it really is imo.

tree

Check yer math, Treeman,..:p .. If Gabe were playing him 12-4, he would only owe 4 balls, then he would need 8 more to win...At 18-4, he would need to spot 10 balls, before hes even.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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SJDinPHX said:
V-man...Please 'explain where I'm wrong in my calc ???:confused::confused: :confused:

SJDinPHX said:
Check yer math, Tree Man,.. .. If Gabe were playing him 12-4, he would only owe 4 balls, then he would need 8 more to win...At 18-4, he would need to spot 10 balls, before hes even.

Are you f@@king nuts? If Gabe was playing him 12-4 he wouldn't spot any balls up, if the score was 11-3 there would be one ball on the table and they'd both need it. If he was playing him 18-4 he would spot 6 and go to 12. Unless you guys are talking about something I'm missing:confused: .

P.S. You completely missed the point of Treemans explanation, not an unprecedented occurrence, Treeman was correct in his explanation, flawed as his reasoning is.

Dennis
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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DogsPlayingPool said:
Oy. Gabe doesn't "owe" any balls according to the rule because the rule, when read in full, actually refers to PENALTY balls owed (and neutral pocket balls). Owed balls doesn't refer to the number of balls you still need to make. If the score is 0-0 and I take an intentional foul, do I now owe one ball or 9 balls? I owe 1 ball.
DPP,

You are the only person (except Rod) in this thread who has made any sense so far, they don't even know what you are talking about or saying to them. You are %100 correct about the way the rule is written and you are also correct that balls needed because of a large spot are NOT owed balls due to penalties or any other reason. They are put up to make the game, that's all, they are not owed.

P.S. You are wasting your valuable time talking with these guys about this question.

Dennis
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Are you f@@king nuts? If Gabe was playing him 12-4 he wouldn't spot any balls up, if the score was 11-3 there would be one ball on the table and they'd both need it. If he was playing him 18-4 he would spot 6 and go to 12. Unless you guys are talking about something I'm missing:confused: .

P.S. You completely missed the point of Treemans explanation, not an unprecedented occurrence, Treeman was correct in his explanation, flawed as his reasoning is.

Dennis

Dear How many times have you played 18 to 4 Breath ???

You can play it that way, the spottor, only spots enough to total 16 balls remaining...I always prefered the other way..You can really build a wall of balls on the spot, playing my way...I played 90% of my high spot games MY way, unless the weaker player, was too smart to go for it...:cool:

The game can be played either way. I prefer owing the 10, and spotting them, if I'm going to 18...I don't care how many he's going to....You still have to make 18 balls regardless of how you do it...If you think about it, it favors the stronger player. The games tough enough, take every advantage you can...:D
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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SJD inPHX said:
Dear How many times have you played 18 to 4 Breath ???

You can play it that way, the spottor, only spots enough to total 16 balls remaining...I always prefer the other way..You can really build a wall of balls on the spot, playing my way...I played 90% of my high spot games MY way, unless the weaker player, was too smart to go for it...:cool:

The game can be played either way, I prefer owing the 10, if I'm going to
18...You still have to make 18 balls regardless of how you do it...If you think about it, it favors the stronger player.
Dear Duck Head,

Nobody asked how you preferred it, you are answering the mans question as if your answer is correct according to the rules and now you are saying its just your "preference". Give an accurate answer or state that your answer is just your personal preference you yo-yo.

P.S. If this Gabe vs. Peat match was the one I watched, Gabe played like a scared little girl and it didn't matter about how the balls were spotted. I thought they played 16-4 too but I'm sure I could be wrong.

RBL
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Dear Duck Head,

Nobody asked how you preferred it, you are answering the mans question as if your answer is correct according to the rules and now you are saying its just your "preference". Give an accurate answer or state that your answer is just your personal preference you yo-yo.

RBL

Edit violation again...Once more and I'll have you banned...:(

Who says there are specific rules governing those (basically PROP) games...?????? An owed ball, is an owed ball...period !!!

I'm going to bed now...my work is done here...Plus you are boring me to death...:eek:
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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SJDinPHX said:
Who says there are specific rules governing those (basically PROP) games...?????? An owed ball is an owed ball...period !!!
When you tell a man that his interpretation of a written OnePocket.org rule is incorrect then are saying there are specific rules and then telling him what they are but now you say it's just your "preference" and you do it because you are the better player. He didn't ask that crap you hockey puck, he asked about the written rule.

P.S. It's not a prop game, both players go to a set amount of balls just like any other game.

P.Ps. An owed ball is an owed ball, who said it ain't?

RBL
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
When you tell a man that his interpretation of a written OnePocket.org rule is incorrect then are saying there are specific rules and then telling him what they are but now you say it's just your "preference" and you do it because you are the better player. He didn't ask that crap you hockey puck, he asked about the written rule.

P.S. It's not a prop game, both players go to a set amount of balls just like any other game.

P.Ps. An owed ball is an owed ball, who said it ain't?

RBL

Please 'splain to me where I told DPP ANY untruth...If you can...:rolleyes: In this scenario, Gabe STILL has to make 18 balls, before Dippy gets 4....The rules are not affected one iota...DPP was trying to differentiate between penalty balls, and owed balls and balls made in the wrong pocket etc...At the end of your inning ALL BALLS YOU OWE SPOT UP...Unless of course the game is over...you doorknob...sheeeesch..!
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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SJDinPHX said:
Please 'splain to me where I told DPP ANY untruth...If you can...:rolleyes:
You'll have to wait, I'm trying to get Cole Dickson on the phone right now:p .

I didn't say you lied you moron, I said you are stating your "preference" as if it's a rigid and correct rule. It's neither.

RBL
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
You'll have to wait, I'm trying to get Cole Dickson on the phone right now:p .

I didn't say you lied you moron, I said you are stating your "preference" as if it's a rigid and correct rule. It's neither.

RBL

If Gabe is playing Dippy 18 to 4, and he runs 17 balls (Dippy has none) It doesn't matter if Gabe spots 6 or 10, he still needs 1, and Dippy needs 4...Right ????? Nothing has changed "rulewise" its just however they agreed to spot owed balls.......G'nite Slatehead...:p :p :p
 

NH Steve

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DogsPlayingPool said:
What it says is "all SUCH" balls should be spotted immediately. The "such' seems to be referring to owed and neutral pocket balls only. Now, if the "such" is meant to mean "all such balls as is necessary to complete the game" then it makes sense, but it certainly isn't clearly written that way. To me the "such" seems to refer to the previous sentence reference to penalty balls owed and neutral pocket balls.

Anyway, I understand the procedure now. Thanks for the info.
This rule is definitely intended to say that all "such" balls (meaning NOT just penalty balls and balls in neutral pockets) are to be spotted at once, not one at a time. I believe the word "such" does not need to imply only a specific reference (the way you are interpreting it) -- I believe it also means, "like" or "similar" and therefore would also refer to balls owed as a result of handicapping.
 

vapros

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Returning to the 12-4 game Dick mentioned, has anyone else played any game in which more balls are spotted than are needed to finish the game? Just asking - I've never seen this. :eek:
 

Jimmy B

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vapros said:
Returning to the 12-4 game Dick mentioned, has anyone else played any game in which more balls are spotted than are needed to finish the game? Just asking - I've never seen this. :eek:


Yes, in this neck of the woods we would just spot what was needed as you say, Vapros. The total is the amount of balls over 16 that you go to. 10-6=no balls spotted. 15-5= 4 balls spotted as soon as you have them. It was too hard for folks arround here to keep score otherwise, but If The Duck says he had customers who agreed to spotting the extra balls over his eight count regardless of what they went to, then he ought to know, as much as he played, and he sure played better than anyone arround here.
 

treeMan

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SJDinPHX said:
If Gabe is playing Dippy 18 to 4, and he runs 17 balls (Dippy has none) It doesn't matter if Gabe spots 6 or 10, he still needs 1, and Dippy needs 4...Right ????? Nothing has changed "rulewise" its just however they agreed to spot owed balls.......G'nite Slatehead...:p :p :p

Hey SJD Dennis already started, albeit with flawed logic, to show your error re my original post, so I won't go into that :p

But pray tell - how the hell is Gabe gonna run 17 balls before spotting any ??? :)

tree
 

androd

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treeMan said:
Hey SJD Dennis already started, albeit with flawed logic, to show your error re my original post, so I won't go into that :p

But pray tell - how the hell is Gabe gonna run 17 balls before spotting any ??? :)

tree

It's done with mirrors.:D :p :)
Rod.
PS. After drinking some Yukon Jack, the old settler sometimes sees double.
 
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